Air Lifting

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wrote in message news:UGZ2f.11947

A pump which generated 30 feet of head will do the job much better and more efficiently. If you are going to buy a pump, you might as well buy the right one.
Bob
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wrote:

What was the ambient PSI when this air lift worked so well? You are a diver, think about it. The lift came from 20 feet of water pressure.
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SteveB wrote:

http://cgi.ebay.com/3-4-HP-1-CAST-IRON-SHALLOW-WELL-PUMP-15768_W0QQitemZ6004882353QQcategoryZ42132QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
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wrote:

I may wish I did not respond to this but here goes. If you are talking like a hydralift where the air is injected into the pipe at the base then you would need around 10lbs to lift 20', however the 10lbs will be pushing back into the tank also.
If you have a strong tank at the base and put 10lbs on it with the outlet at the bottom it will push the water out first.
Think I'm right at 1/2lb per ft.
My $0.02 John
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The air rising will lift some of the water.

Plastic barrels don't hold a lot of pressure, and the bungs leak easily.

Actually, .434#/ft. @ 39 degrees F. Salt Water, .443#

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I think that you'll have better service if you use some kind of a centrifigul or rotary vane pump that's designed for pumping water.
Think in terms of RV fresh water pumps, or perhaps bilge pumps. Keep the pump as low as possible. It's a lot easier to push water than to pull it. Perhaps even keep the pump lower than the truck tank.
--

Christopher A. Young
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SteveB wrote:

I see no one else mentioned it. There is such a thing as 'bubble' lifting. Basically small diameter tubing with air inserted in the bottom, It doesn't work by 'suction' but by the natural force of a bubble rising in water. Each bubble pushes a slug of water up teh tube as it rises. That should work but it would be a slow proposition. There was quite a discussion of that plus other options over on alt.energy.homepower recently but I don't recall the thread title. Involved moving water 200 ft uphill. they seemed to think it would work there.
Harry K
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SteveB wrote: ....
I doubt if you are going to make it to the top. I suggest a real water pump. Using air to pump from the bottom to the surface of water works, but it does not work well above the surface of the water (a second surface does not count)
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Joseph Meehan

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It's not clear what kind of pump you're envisioning, a venturi pump, or a bubble-lift, because you start talking about one, and then end up babbling about the other. but neither one is going to work for your intended application anyway.
Is this overhead tank pressurized?

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Babble, babble, babble, babble, babble ........................
Thanks for your help.
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It's actually a good (unanswered) question. If you are trying to pump into a pressure tank, you will need a stronger pump to pressurize it.
Bob
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This works *under* water because the water/air mixture is lighter than the surrounding water, and thus rises. *above* water, this won't work.
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wrote:

I'll wager a days pay against a donut hole that it will work. If you put some air pressure on there, it will blow the water out the other end a good distance.
In everything engineering, I take things to the nth degree. Imagine what it would be like if you put just enough air in the line to percolate small bubbles up the column of water. Now imagine 150psi of air.
Do you think that will move some water?
As I said, a days pay against a donut hole. I get $85 per hour, so that's $680 betting that it will work.
The downside is that one poster stated that the quality of air will contaminate the water with oil, and he is correct. So, I have opted for a pump instead.
But yes, the idea will work, and it would work for a very long distance if the venturi is configured to pull the water into the airstream.
Steve
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A venturi is different from an airlift. A venturi might work, but you'd sure be using a lot of air for little water pumped.
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wrote:

In the original post, I mentioned "venturiing". Any compressor will move a lot of air if it isn't being compressed, and any old compressor can shoot enough air into a venturi, and then have it rise through a column of water to work. Remember, the top of the column of water will be open, so there will only be the resistance of the water. The trick, to me, would be to keep the diameter of the hose small enough so that the bubbles make a 360 degree contact with the walls of the tube.
One day when I have nothing to do, I shall set this up and let you know how well it works.
Steve
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wrote:

How do you plan on filling the water-column in the first place? And why don't you just use THAT method to fill the tank?
And if you're depending on the venturi-effect to get the water into the lift-column, how do you expect to get ENOUGH water in there to seal in the next bubble? All you're going to get is an atomized spray. That will, admittedly, get a nominal amount of water to the top of the exhaust port, just not enough to matter.
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wrote:

Well, dude, it looks like you have it all figured out. Thanks a lot for saving me a lot of time. But then, I do have a lot of time, and an unsatisfied curiosity, so, I think I will just play around with it some time.
IF that's okay with you, that is.
Steve
"Whether you think you can do it or not, you're right." -Henry Ford-
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Goedjn wrote:

Wrong. The tube starts out empty. Tube goes to bottom of tank into a "bell" with the air inserted under it. Not a big trick.
Harry K
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Ok, when YOU use the word "venturi", what do you mean?
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Goedjn wrote:

I haven't used the word. A venturi operates on the principle of a reduced section of pipe (in this proposed system) with an air injection (or water) mounted so the nozzle is in, or just before, the reduced section. A jet pump works on the same priciple, pump a bunch of water up the pipe to draw more water into the stream. I actually built a "mud" siphon of plumbing parts to clear siltation from a smal irrigation pond, used water for the moving from the irrigation pump for the motive source.
Harry K
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