Air conditioner outlet is 220 v; how can i run a 110v line off this?

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around here 2 hot, one ground and a white neutral.....
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snipped-for-privacy@aol.com wrote:

That's "new" NEC code (don't recall year; been a while but relatively recently). Before then, 240V single phase was 3-wire universally accepted. It's quite probable that's all there is since it hasn't been that long that 4-wire wasn't required to meet Code.
--
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4 wire is not required by NEC for a 240 volt air-conditioner outlet, unless the manufacturer made a unit that required a neutral for some reason. Haller is being Haller as usual. Why would a neutral be required when there is no place on the outlet to connect it

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RBM wrote:

Didn't say (nor mean to imply it) was; only referring to 3- vs 4-wire.
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Don't you mean the second takes 5A of each hot?
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Don't you mean the second takes 5A of each hot? ----------------------- No I don't. 5A off each hot would be 5a at 240v, which is only 1200w. 2400w is 10a off each hot.
The confusing part is that each hot is only 120v to ground, not 240v. They are only 240v to each other. So either way you have 20a on 120v hots; on a 120v circuit it all comes from one hot, on 240v it is split between two hots.
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You are saying that there is 10A in each leg. Where is the 10A going? Not to the neutral obviously since it's not being used. The current flows from one feed to the other, and that total current is 10A. The way you make it sound its 20A total. If you had an amprobe on a 120V A/C at the panel (either on the hot or the neutral) you will read 20A. If you did the same with a 220V A/C you would get 10A through either feed. The end result is you use half the current, thus easing up demand on the panel.
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You are saying that there is 10A in each leg. Where is the 10A going? Not to the neutral obviously since it's not being used. The current flows from one feed to the other, and that total current is 10A. The way you make it sound its 20A total. If you had an amprobe on a 120V A/C at the panel (either on the hot or the neutral) you will read 20A. If you did the same with a 220V A/C you would get 10A through either feed. The end result is you use half the current, thus easing up demand on the panel.
---------------- You win, you are too ignorant for me!
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[snip]
It's the same 10A. Those 2 hots are in series through the 240V unit. The above makes it sound like there's 20A somewhere. There isn't.
[snip]
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Imagine a multiwire circuit. One side has a 120w bulb on it, the other has nothing. There is 1a on one side, 0a on the other. 1a returns on the neutral. There is 1a. Okay so far?
Now put another 120w bulb on the other side. There are 2a, 1a on each side. 0a returns on the neutral. Still okay?
Now remove the neutral; nothing changes as nothing was returning on it anyhow. You still have 2a, 1 on each side. Almost there.
BUT, it is now a 240v circuit! And there are (drumroll please) 2a on it; 1 on each hot! There is absolutely no difference between a multiwire circuit and and 240v with neutral.
Can't make it any simpler.
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Try that experiment with a TV and let me know if it works.
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Imagine 2 police checkpoints 100 feet apart on a highway. Checkpoint A has detected 50 cars passing between 4PM and 5PM. Checkpoint B has detected 50 cars during the same time period. Were 100 cars on that highway between 4PM and 5PM?
What you're saying is like saying there were 100 cars. Specifically, 10A (at the phase 1 breaker for that 240V load) and 10A (at the phase 2 breaker for that 240V load), which you added improperly the same way I added 50 and 50 in my example.
If you disagree, at least try thinking about it.
The fact you can add NUMBERS doesn't mean it's a legitimate operation in the real world.
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Sorry, I thought you would know what a multiwire circuit was. You probably have to know basic electricity to understand it.
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[snip]

Knowing basic electricity doesn't do as much good as it should, when you don't actually think about it.
Considering your 2-light example:
L1 ------------breaker1---------light1-----------\\ | neutral | ----------------------------------------------* "A" | L2 | ------------breaker2----------light2----------/
Where both lights are equal.
1. 1A in flowing through breaker1 2. no current is flowing through the neutral
WHERE is the current coming in through breaker1 going?
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wrote:

Well, lets see. You have two currents identical, except for being 180 degrees out of phase with one another. Gosh, what could happen to them? Consider 3phase. 3 identical currents, except for being 120 degrees out of phase with one another. What do you think happens to them? Don't strain yourself.
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You really should stop now.
You are clueless.
There is one current and it is "in phase" with the voltage for a resistive load.
You are either 1) A dumb ass or 2) So smart and so much going on that you are mixing it up
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wrote:

Okay, maybe I can make it a little simpler for those that don't know what a multiwire circuit is.
Imagine two circuits; one each on opposite legs of the service, with a 120v light on each. They each have 1a and 120w. If you cut neutrals, the lights will go out. If you then connect the two cut neutrals, they will each light exactly as they were before. Each will still have 1a going through them. Absolutely NOTHING has changed on the hot wire. Absolutely NOTHING. You still have two 120v circuits and each hot carries 1a. It will work for lights, motors, even televisions.
But of course they are now on a 240v circuit, so to speak.
If that doesn't help, then I give up.
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Clueless
It is the same one amp. It is a series circuit.
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Your experiment makes no sense, it is similiar to a string of Christmas lights. You are putting 2 identical loads in series with 220. If you hook up just one bulb across the 2 phases, it would burn out. Try putting 2 bulbs in series across 110V. Guess what happens, the bulbs get dim because of voltage drop.
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Your experiment makes no sense, it is similiar to a string of Christmas lights. You are putting 2 identical loads in series with 220. If you hook up just one bulb across the 2 phases, it would burn out. Try putting 2 bulbs in series across 110V. Guess what happens, the bulbs get dim because of voltage drop. ------------------------ I might as well talk to my dog; at least she doesn't make unrelated replies. (and if you wire 5 bulbs across 5000v...)
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