Wax over stain on oak?

I've just applied a second coat of Minwax Golden Oak stain on new red oak, and I'm delighted with the results. In order to protect the finish, does the assembled wisdom suggest a rub down with something like paste wax, or should I go to a polyurethane coating? The piece is an entry table, my major project in my 3rd year apprentice program, and the top is a cast concrete slab with a line drawing of a carpenter's arms running a plane. My tastes, I freely confess, run to the classic, old fashioned, and some might say antiquated. The wax would be closer to my taste, but perhaps the poly is better.
Cheers, and advTHANKSance Colin
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On Sun, 6 May 2018 04:37:09 -0000 (UTC), Colin Campbell

Who is going to own it ? .. someone who knows & appreciates the difference between wax and poly ? if yes - wax if no poly John T.
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Either. The poly has protection against scratches, wax doesn't but hall tables - especially with concrete tops - aren't usually to brutal treatment.
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On Saturday, May 5, 2018 at 11:37:12 PM UTC-5, Colin Campbell wrote:

On a project like this, which is to put you and your skills on display, fol low your gut. Also, always consider the likelihood of wear on the surface. The top is always takes the most wear, but that slab is not going to have a problem. Assuming you seal it somehow, water stains, etc will just not be a worry. The case and legs, especially the legs, will get the occasiona l bump or scratch, but a quick rewax and you are good to go,
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On Sunday, May 6, 2018 at 7:54:16 AM UTC-5, Dr. Deb wrote:

cratch, but a quick rewax and you are good to go,
I vote wax, also.
Additionally (blather?): Another option, for temporarily repairing leg/case scratches and dings, is to use a wax crayon. "Color" over the scratch/ding, with an appropriate c olor, rub to create heat. If you ever need to refinish, the wax is easily removed using the remover.
Several fairly good paste waxes, out there, as long as they don't contain t oo much oil, if any, or if they don't contain silicone. I often use Pate' Dugay.... kinna expensive, in various colors, but a can lasts a long long time. It doesn't take much to wax a piece, so a can will last very long t ime. Might not be worth the expense, if not used often enough. I do par t-time upholstery; I fairly often wax/polish the woodwork of a piece, with Pate' Dugay, before the reupholstering.
I used Tre-Wax on raw ER cedar wood display cabinet/open shelf unit, 35-40 yrs ago. reapplied 15-20 yrs ago. Still nice and smooth, looks nice, easy to dust, no color fading (that I'm aware of).
Sonny
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On Sunday, May 6, 2018 at 10:40:32 AM UTC-4, Sonny wrote:

scratch, but a quick rewax and you are good to go,

s to use a wax crayon. "Color" over the scratch/ding, with an appropriate color, rub to create heat. If you ever need to refinish, the wax is easi ly removed using the remover.

too much oil, if any, or if they don't contain silicone. I often use Pat e' Dugay.... kinna expensive, in various colors, but a can lasts a long lon g time. It doesn't take much to wax a piece, so a can will last very long time. Might not be worth the expense, if not used often enough. I do p art-time upholstery; I fairly often wax/polish the woodwork of a piece, wi th Pate' Dugay, before the reupholstering.

0 yrs ago. reapplied 15-20 yrs ago. Still nice and smooth, looks nice, ea sy to dust, no color fading (that I'm aware of).

re: "no color fading (that I'm aware of)"
I believe it was Jack that made the same claim about a something he made/bought/not_sure many years ago. When somebody pushed back, he managed to find a spot that was hidden from the light all those years. He came back and humbly expressed his amazement at how much it had actually faded. Livin g with a piece day in and day out without something "new" to compare it to, you'll never notice the slow change.
AS an example...
SWMBO and I went to a John McCutcheon concert a few weeks. As people took their seats, I leaned over to SWMBO and whispered "There's a lot of old people here". She just laughed. ;-)
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My stock line - when I see a 20 or 30 - something in the audience - " Who let them in ? " ... thoroughly enjoyed Shari Ulrich Trio last night .. http://www.shariulrich.com/ John T.
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On 5/6/2018 3:23 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Twas I and it was a walnut piece I'd made about 35+ years ago, and finished with spray lacquer, no stain.
My self, since the top is cement, I would finish the rest with anything but wax. I was never a fan of just wax, prefer shellac, lacquer, varnish, poly, oil. In this case I probably would use several coats of shellac since water/alcohol contact is unlikely. If I made it, I probably would have considered a danish oil stain, particularly if you want oak to be stained dark as in walnut. Shellac is my favorite though, easy to spray or apply with a rag and always looks great on hardwood.
I've never done a cement top though. What would you seal that with? Nothing? Thompsons? I dunno.
--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
  Click to see the full signature.
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On Wednesday, May 9, 2018 at 9:08:19 AM UTC-4, Jack wrote:

or scratch, but a quick rewax and you are good to go,

, is to use a wax crayon. "Color" over the scratch/ding, with an appropri ate color, rub to create heat. If you ever need to refinish, the wax is e asily removed using the remover.

ain too much oil, if any, or if they don't contain silicone. I often use Pate' Dugay.... kinna expensive, in various colors, but a can lasts a long long time. It doesn't take much to wax a piece, so a can will last very l ong time. Might not be worth the expense, if not used often enough. I d o part-time upholstery; I fairly often wax/polish the woodwork of a piece, with Pate' Dugay, before the reupholstering.

5-40 yrs ago. reapplied 15-20 yrs ago. Still nice and smooth, looks nice, easy to dust, no color fading (that I'm aware of).

ged

back

iving

o,

I somewhat agree with You Jack about Slellac finish I restore a lot of anti ques and it's a joy to when I identify their finish is shellac this stuff really ages well and is easily brought back to life when You are not afraid to renew the look away from shabby sheik. I an very interested in a product I have not Yet Tried = "Shellac Flat" Which dulls shellac This would be handy on some older worn shellac finishes requiring less gloss. SHELLAC FLAT #7080 /SHELLAC FLAT- Flattening Agent for liquid – $17.95 – 16 OZ. BOTTLE Homestead Finishing Products P O Box 360275 Strongsville OH 44136-0005 Tel # 216-631-5309 Another Great Product I like is Waterlox Tung oil Varnish https://www.waterlox.com/ I thin this stuff with Naptha water consistency and hand rub up to 20 coa ts. I daily yep up to 20 days worth wet sanding 1000 grit between make sure it ’s very dry and free from moisture between wet Sanding and rubs I m ake a pad like You would for French Polish for this. The finish dries Hard and is very durable like a Samurai Sword when completely cured after a coup le of weeks. All good things take time. I have refinished many Antiques an d Acoustic Guitars with this process.
I also love Working with Behlen Stringed Instrument nitrocelluloce Laquer. https://www.shellac.net/instrument_lacquer_howto.html on a newer project or replacement part to a laquer finished piece.
I will post a new Question about shellac flat if someone Has used it. rick B.
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On 5/9/2018 11:00 AM, Rick the antique guy wrote:

Yes, I used this on a record cabinet I made about 40 years ago. Still looks good to this day. Have no idea why I never used it again, as it was easy to apply and quite durable. The record cabinet does not get abused. Table tops I've used almost exclusively poly because it is durable and unaffected by water/alcohol and about every thing else other than 4 year olds with a knife carving initials. I only recently re-discovered shellac. Never liked it because of how it water stains so easily. I now prefer it over most everything if it's not a table top.

Wow, I never put that much into a finish, way too lazy.

I never used it, never heard of it actually. I sometimes have a hard time deciding glossy or satin varnish... speaking of varnish, for construction wood (fir/spruce used for work benches and such) I like varnish, spar varnish. I like how it yellows, no stain. Poly doesn't yellow much so preserves the ugly look of construction grade firs. Also, I've used BLO a lot with clear shellac or poly overcoat for the same reasons.
The last larger piece I've made was a dresser a couple years ago, and I can't remember what finish I used. (it's written on the cabinet back though). Amazing because I clearly remember what I used on that record cabinet 40 years ago... age is funny sometimes.
--
Jack
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions.
  Click to see the full signature.
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On Wednesday, May 9, 2018 at 9:08:19 AM UTC-4, Jack wrote:

or scratch, but a quick rewax and you are good to go,

, is to use a wax crayon. "Color" over the scratch/ding, with an appropri ate color, rub to create heat. If you ever need to refinish, the wax is e asily removed using the remover.

ain too much oil, if any, or if they don't contain silicone. I often use Pate' Dugay.... kinna expensive, in various colors, but a can lasts a long long time. It doesn't take much to wax a piece, so a can will last very l ong time. Might not be worth the expense, if not used often enough. I d o part-time upholstery; I fairly often wax/polish the woodwork of a piece, with Pate' Dugay, before the reupholstering.

5-40 yrs ago. reapplied 15-20 yrs ago. Still nice and smooth, looks nice, easy to dust, no color fading (that I'm aware of).

ged

back

iving

o,

I somewhat agree with You Jack about Slellac finish I restore a lot of anti ques and it's a joy to when I identify their finish is shellac this stuff really ages well and is easily brought back to life when You are not afraid to renew the look away from shabby sheik. I an very interested in a product I have not Yet Tried = "Shellac Flat" Which dulls shellac This would be handy on some older worn shellac finishes requiring less gloss. SHELLAC FLAT #7080 /SHELLAC FLAT- Flattening Agent for liquid – $17.95 – 16 OZ. BOTTLE Homestead Finishing Products P O Box 360275 Strongsville OH 44136-0005 Tel # 216-631-5309 Another Great Product I like is Waterlox Tung oil Varnish https://www.waterlox.com/ I thin this stuff with Naptha water consistency and hand rub up to 20 coa ts. I daily yep up to 20 days worth wet sanding 1000 grit between make sure it ’s very dry and free from moisture between wet Sanding and rubs I m ake a pad like You would for French Polish for this. The finish dries Hard and is very durable like a Samurai Sword when completely cured after a coup le of weeks. All good things take time. I have refinished many Antiques an d Acoustic Guitars with this process.
I also love Working with Behlen Stringed Instrument nitrocelluloce Laquer. https://www.shellac.net/instrument_lacquer_howto.html on a newer project or replacement part to a laquer finished piece.
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On Sun, 06 May 2018 07:40:30 -0700, Sonny wrote:

Thanks to all who gave advice and experience, which are both much appreciated. I decided on a simple coat of hand-rubbed beeswax, and here is the result: https://photos.google.com/share/ AF1QipNq3huoQ1NHxuiqfxfTrnEEIUG2oxhT5ynxtoDK9XcXWzBvqcxY5lX3t9HqeyX34Q? key=bVZMbWE2VXRhb1F2T25maTkzODd4RFU4RVYtOHZR
Cheers, Colin
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On Saturday, May 12, 2018 at 7:25:44 PM UTC-4, Colin Campbell wrote:

Hi Colin Check Your Url on this pic it will not open up. rick b.
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On Sunday, May 13, 2018 at 8:10:18 PM UTC-4, Rick the antique guy wrote:

It works, you just have to eliminate the spaces...
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On Sunday, May 13, 2018 at 8:10:18 PM UTC-4, Rick the antique guy wrote:

Here's a shortened version:
https://tinyurl.com/colin-entry-table
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On Sun, 13 May 2018 19:17:37 -0700, DerbyDad03 wrote:

Thanks, DerbyDad! How did you do that?
Cheers, Colin
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On Monday, May 14, 2018 at 1:06:40 AM UTC-4, Colin Campbell wrote:

www.tinyurl.com
It's self explanatory once you see the site.
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On 5/5/2018 11:37 PM, Colin Campbell wrote:

Just stain or Minwax Polyshades? If the later, do nothing. If stain, wax will only add some shine but no protection.
Or use something like Old Masters gel varnish. It goes on very thin but adds more protection than wax. You will need about 3 coats. Wipe on and immediately wipe off and with a second cloth buff, IMMEDIATELY. Repeat above 2~3 more times.
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Hi Colin one of my fav. go to Old chool finishes is Beeswax. Get a block of Beeswax at a True Value store, Woodworkers Warehouse or whe rever you can find it . Test it with your fingernail the harder the better . Use an old metal food grater to flake it. You may want to save it for this exclusive purpose and buy a newer one for the kitchen. Then get an old sauc epan or pot you will forever use for this purpose and put in the beeswax fl akes. Next get a larger saucepan or pot, that the smaller pan will comforta bly fit into with space around for water. Put the wax saucepan into the larger one and add enough water in until the smaller one just starts to Float. now you have a double boiler. Make sure You have a good cover that will fit the wax saucepan or pot. Next add a small amount of turpentine into the pan with the wax flakes. Some folks substitute Mineral oil instead. This is also good but not as har d of a finish and is more sticky. However Bees Wax & Mineral Oil is a great food grade combo for cutting boards, children's toys and Butcher Blocks. Back to the turpentine Mix or mineral oil heating process. Turn up the heat to low preferably electric burner under the double boiler Don't walk away too far because You want to avoid Burning or flash point, i gnition. Stir with an old spoon or I prefer a wooden paint stirrer, Keep mi xing until it’s one consistency, Keep the cover handy especially w ith gas stoves to quickly snuff out any flame if it catches. This has neve r happened to me but it can. I hear if most of the water has boiled away an d the temperature rises to the flashpoint. So make sure you add water to t he water pan carefully and not into the wax ,because the wax will explode on you. You do not run out of water then your temperature will not get any higher than 212 deg F. Probably the safest place for this is outside on a barbeque grill rather than the kitchen range. I have a cheap electric hotpl ate in my shop for it. O.k. when this stuff is pourable pour it into a good water tight tin of app ropriate size for the volume of your batch. Don't get any of this hot stuff on your skin, or you will surely blister it with 1st. or 2nd. degree burns . Option 1 Let it cool it will become the consistency of butchers wax. Option 2 leave it in the hot pot and while it is liquid brush the stuff on your wood project Be cautious to protect your skin and eyes in case of a s plash. This hot process penetrates The wood fibers better than the cold pr ocess. With either process be sure to wipe off any excess after a few minut es. let dry and rub it out. This is a repairable finish although it will not remove a deep scratch if y ou get one an application of the same mix on the scratch will blend it in l ike it was there before the finish. I know this has been a long drawn out instruction but do not ignore the saf ety aspects. You will have a nice alternative finish at Your disposal. Also realize Minwax oil and other stains have Tung oil and petroleum solven ts which are poison so don't use it in conjunction with the food grade or t oy projects.
Have fun finishing Old school Rick B.
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