Shop light saga continues

[Bay Area Dave]

Took back 6 light fixtures to Orchard Supply today after they urged me to return them when I told them of the many burned out bulbs. Since I posted the other thread about fluorescents, 2 more bulbs burned out that were marked with the install date: Jan 4, 2004. Lasted a mere 11 days.

I bought 6 new and different brand of fixtures for $20 each. Sub zero, rapid start, switch, etc. Put one up in the shop, then opened the next box: broken socket. Opened the next one: broken. and the next. and the next. ALL 6 were broken (boxes were in perfect shape).

Went to another location where they had 4 in stock. Three were broken. bought one.

Now I'm on my way across town to ANOTHER Orchard Supply where rumor has it they have 9 in stock.

Does this sort of thing ever happen to YOU??

dave

[Rumpty]

No.

[Edwin Pawlowski]

Never. Rare that I see a broken item when I bring it home.

[Bay Area Dave]

Just got back from the 3rd store: out of 6 units, guess how many were broken. SIX! Every fixture in 6 unopened boxes had broken sockets. What a great way to spend Friday...

dave

Bay Area Dave wrote:

[Greg O]

Nope! I just get deals on like new, two bulb flouresant fixtures for free! By the way, I got the shop painted again, lights mounted and wired. I think I reached saturation point on lighting in the shop. I worked on the wife's car all afternoon last week end. When I was closing up the shop I realized I did not have ALL the lights turned on! At this point I have 24, four foot, two bulb fixtures in the shop, (24' x 38' shop), plus five or six

100 watt incandesants. Darned near need sunglasses! Greg

[Bay Area Dave]

Wow! You've got me beat on candlepower, Greg. I've got 9 (correction, I HAD 9 fixtures until I returned 5 that were installed and 1 I didn't take out of the box). I replaced ONE lonely fixture, as 15 others were broken at 3 stores I went to today! I don't have any incandescent ones. Oh, Greg, if you REALLY are serious about having major rays streaking down from you ceiling, replace all your fluorescents with the dual 150W halogens that are shaped like fluorescent fixtures! I tried one out in the store today and almost decided to take one home until I realized I don't want to be burning 300 watts per fixture. Plus they get hotter than hell. Imagine having just ten of those bad boys; 3,000 watts! Griswold would be proud.

dave

Greg O wrote:

[Tim Carver]

Have you taken a look at the $7.99 or so shop lights that HD is currently selling? I think they are by "Commercial Electric" or something like that. I don't normally go for el cheapo shop lights, but these have electronic ballasts (supposedly will start down to 0 degress or something like that) and will work for either T8's or T12's. I just bought a few for undercabinet lights. They seem to work great, although I've no idea how long they will last since I just installed them a couple of weeks ago. They are considerably better than the normal cheap shoplights with the plastic ends - these are all metal, reasonably sturdy, and they have a nice heavy enamel finish.

Tim Carver [e-mail]

[Bob Davis]

Why are you torturning yourself? Is there something special about these fixtures? I bought the hanging 2 bulb 48" shoplights at Lowe's for $7.99. Bulbs cost another $2. They work flawlessly.

Bob

[Tom Kohlman]

As I emptied the last 2 of my Phillips T12 bulbs from the borg "contractor pack", couldn't help but notice that it explictily says on the box that they are meant only for fixtures with 34w ballasts. Seems to me that most older fixtures had 40w ballasts. That might explain your problem with short life (although mine don't seem to last too long either but out of the last 10 pack, 8 have survived at least six months). Now that I think about it, maybe it isn't the bulb at all but rather the cheap chinese $10 borg fixtures rated at 34w are probably shooting too much juice. The borg also sells a pretty nice T8 fixture that includes a grate and has a pull chain switch for less than $20 (bulbs not included). Still too early to comment on bulb life but if they turn out to be short also, then I guess I'll conclude that when it comes to shop lighting fixtures you get what you pay for and the borg is not the place to go.

Here in the NE USA the halogen is nice, at least ConEd thinks so. I use it for intense task lighting only although I guess if I used it more often I could probably hook up an exhaust fan to the electric meter.

[Bay Area Dave]

I tried some of their Lithonia lights; they weren't as bright. Took them back and got the ones from Orchard with electronic ballasts for $11.99. Then I started replacing bulbs left and right...

dave

Tim Carver wrote:

[Bay Area Dave]

nothing special except I can't find any others. I've tried HD's Lithonia last year; they don't drive the bulbs as brightly. I'm not near a Lowes. The ONE I got today is working fine, so far. Comes on instantly and is bright. Now if I can get 5 more, I'll be able to see what I'm doing in the shop.

dave

Bob Davis wrote:

[Victor Radin]

What I'm not understanding is why no one has mentioned opening the box at the store before checkout, drive home, install, damnit-don't-work, uninstall, drive back, see manager, wait for refund, find replacements, rinse & repeat. BTDT, don't need another t-shirt.

I've never had a problem with either a cashier or manager when I ask to open any box for inspection prior to payment. I may have problems if there's a long line behind me... so check for that first. If there's lines, then I go to the service desk and get the manager to open them for me to inspect there- and usually wind up avoiding the lines too.

I get a working whatever without the hassle or return trips, lines, accusatory managers suspicious that *I'VE* tossed my old broken whatsis in the box in place of their good model. And best of all- it just plain annoyed the hell outta one particular manager at the Orange Borg that insisted EVERYTHING he sold is perfect before we find 4 of 5 broken-in- box from sealed, fresh stock.

BTW- this applies at any of the big box stores- electronics, computers, appliances, toys, home centers.

Open and inspect it before you walk out of the store.

/vic

[Greg G.]

I guess that is why a good electronic ballast costs more than what you paid for the whole fixture. All ballasts are not created equal...

Seriously, I had a couple of those cheap 'electronic ballast' lamps and one blew up. Took it apart to fix it, and after seeing how they were made, I threw the rest of them away. They were bulb eaters.

Since you pay more for everything anyway , why not get some Osram/Sylvania Quicktronic T-8 ballasts. They have regulated outputs, start below 0 degrees and have a >20,000 hour bulb life - guaranteed!

Oh, I forgot - You bought some cheap fixtures that won't accept a real ballast... ;-)

FWIW,

Greg G.

[Bay Area Dave]

maybe I didn't make myself clear, Victor:

I didn't expect new fixtures to be broken. After finding 6 broken fixtures at one store, I went to another store and OPENED the 4 boxes they had in stock. One was undamaged. I bought it and it works.

Went to another store where there were 6. Opened them all. All were broken. Left the store without purchasing anything.

So, I don't need a lecture on common sense...

dave

Victor Rad> What I'm not understanding is why no one has mentioned opening the box

[Bay Area Dave]

Hey, I even tried to get 8 footers and the clerk said not only do they not have any in stock, but that they are all designed to be mounted on the ceiling, instead of hung from chains. I have a suspended ceiling in my studio, er, shop.

I'm still gonna try to get some more of those $20 sub zero start units...only need 5 more. :)

dave

Greg wrote:

[Greg G.]

I'm sure you know the difference, but just in case you misunderstood, T-8 is not an 8 foot tube, it's a smaller diameter tube than a T-12 (old style conventional). They burn a little brighter, cheaper (34 watts), and longer than the T-12 types, and are reduced mercury. In your neck of the woods, they are probably *required* by law for use in all commercial buildings.

I wish I could fit 8 footers in my stud^h^h^h^h shop - the ceiling is broken up by load-bearing engineered joists, so I'm limited to 4 footers as well - and I still need more of them. This week, more clamps won out.

Hope you get it all sorted out, however. That PM66 isn't doing you any good in the dark. ;-)

Greg G.

[Ron Magen]

Davey-Boy, I've been following this 'thread' for a bit . . . maybe the 'problem' is a 'Coastal' thing?

I live on the 'other Coast' . . . or at least about 60 miles from it . . . Philly suburbs. My shop is in the back yard, unheated, and we have the household heat turned down, and I've closed most of the vents to the basement & it's 'auxiliary' shop.

It is plain COLD in the shop and definitely 'cool' in the basement. The 'big fixtures' in the 'shop' were there when we moved in . . . maybe 25 years ago. A couple of them are still there, although I've changed to 'lamps' a couple of times. I replaced the single-bulb incandescent fixtures with a couple of 2-lamp fixtures I got used from a store that was remodeling. A while ago I installed about 4 more 4-foot 'El Cheapo' Borg fixtures in the shop, and got a quantity of 'El Cheapo' lamps to go with them.

Anyhow, what usually happens with me, the lamps simply 'dim out' with age. The fixture - the I-don't-know-how-old-when-I-got-it-used - finally 'died' {I could smell the ballast 'cooking'} after I had it 20+ years. Replaced it with a Borg 'El Cheapo'. Do I get a slight 'flicker' when it's cold in the shop ? . . . yes. Usually lasts until they warm up or I get the stove fired up. Do they 'flicker' in the basement . . . Yes and No. The one by the far wall, over the sink & near the window does, yet the one over the bench by the door doesn't, nor the one over the bench on the back wall doesn't either. {I think the one is simply a loose or oxidized lamp contact}.

FWIW . . . Regards & Good Luck, Ron Magen Backyard Boatshop

[Greg O]

Geez! I forgot to mention I have two 500 watt halogen floods mounted on the ceiling also! They are mounted to the ceiling, right in front of where the car would be parked. They are great to light up under the hood. Other than that I don't use them much because of potential sunburn! I do place the table saw under one, great lighting, but a few shadows. Greg

[Matt Zach]

[Lawrence A. Ramsey]