Plunge or non-plunge router better under table?

Religious war. Those who prefer either will defend to the death their choice.

Just for the record, I am a proponent of plunge, specifically the one that the Rosendahls (the guys you're talking about) used mostly (they've used Dewallies and P-Cs, as well); the Hitachi M12V (and when all the sponsorship left, they continued to use the Hitachis painted a putrid purple).

- - LRod

Master Woodbutcher and seasoned termite

Shamelessly whoring my website since 1999

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LRod
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Which is better under a router table, plunge or non-plunge? I've watched the Router Workshop on TV with the older guy and his son and they swear by the plunge router with the springs removed. Is there a real advantage to that or is it just individual preferences?

Gerry < so many questions, so little knowledge >

P.S. Yet another question, is there a proper name for "non-plunge"?

Reply to
G.E.R.R.Y.

When they're under, can't tell what it is. For ease of adjustment when above the table, I prefer a plunge like the router guys use. Better clearances for access to the collet, no twist and torque.

Reply to
George

Never use the plunge in a table. If you are using a router lift, the fixed base is the way to go. Triton plunge and maybe a couple of others are now more "table friendly" for adjusting.

I have a Benchdog lift and it is simple and accurate to adjust. Others will do the same thing. Ed

Reply to
Edwin Pawlowski

Good question and I just ordered a new under table router to replace my Bosch 1611, 15 amp plunge router. My 1611 is similar to the current 1619, a big router. My 1611 is 16 years old and has no modern features other that it is electric. Anyway, what you want is a router that you can fine tune the height adjustment with some sort of adjustment knob after making your quick coarse height adjustment. Note my mentioning "after" making your Quick coarse adjustment. You do not want one of those after market threaded tubes with a knob on it. Those take forever to run up and down from one end of adjustment to the other end. Something to look at for example is the adjustment setup on the newest Milwaukee routers the Bosch 1613 or 1619 or the Triton router. All of these routers and I am sure a slew of others will work nicely under the table. Some are fixed base, some are plunge base. Your main concern is to be able to make coarse height adjustments quickly and then be able to fine tune that adjustment. I also have a Bosch 1617evs router that would work great in my router table but it is kinda small for some of the bits that I spin on my router table. If you are turning common horizontal raised panel bits I strongly suggest one of the 15 amp "aka" 3+ hp routers with VARIABLE speed. You need to slow those big bits down to the

10,000 rpm range.

So today I went down to buy my 6th router and had narrowed the choices down to the fixed base 5625-20 Milwaukee or the plunge base Triton. I had considered the Bosch 1619 evs but because of the location of the fine tune adjustment knob it would be behind the router when turned up side down or on the left side of the router. Neither of those locations appealed to me. The Milwaukee is a beast and well made. Simple. Variable speed, fast coarse adjustment, good fine tune height adjustment knob and the ability to make fine tune height adjustments "above" the table. It is also a 2 wrench router which I GREATLY prefer over the single wrench models. BUT, I found that when the Milwaukee is upside down and you push the coarse adjustment knob to make an adjustment, you better have a both hands on the router to keep it from falling out of the fixed base. While the above table height adjustment is a cool idea I can see the hole in the table top filling with saw dust and clogging the mechanism even though there is a plastic cover that opens when you push an adjustment tool through it.

So now I turn to the plunge base Triton, Seems to be designed from the ground up to be hung under the table or used free hand. While I have read many mixed reviews about 3 or 4 specific problems, these apparently have all been addressed and the new production Tritons have been fitted with the fixes. I ordered the Triton from the Woodcraft store. They were sold out. The big pluses I see here is that bits can be changed from above the table top. While this is a 1 wrench router like my current Bosch 1611 the router will remain in the base during a bit change. While 1 wrench routers sound simpler to use, you still have to use your other hand to hold the router and or the router shaft lock. So what have you gained by only using 1 wrench? With 2 wrench routers, you can loosen or tighten the collet with 1 hand. 2 hands are still needed to make coarse adjustments to the collet. The Triton having a self locking shaft and not requiring removal of the router from the table may be somewhere in between the 2 wrench and 1 wrench style as far as ease is concerned. I suspect one hand will be on the wrench and the other holding the router cabinet to keep it from moving when loosening or tightening the collet. The Triton will not fall out of its base when making coarse adjustments under the table.

Other nice touches that the Triton has over other plunge based routers are, the adjustable depth turret is second to none and simple to use requiring no screw driver or wrench for multiple height adjustments. This may or may not be useful in a router table. The Triton comes with an edge guide for free hand use.

Routers are generally plunge base or "non-plunge" fixed base.

Reply to
Leon

Some plunge routers can be adjusted for height with the router under the table--the plunge mechanism becomes in effect a router lift. That's not possible with any non-plunge I know of unless you use a router lift. On the other hand, the highest-capacity non-plunge routers can swing a larger diameter bit than the highest capacity plunge routers with the exception, I believe, of the Triton. Really depends on what you want to do and how much you want to spend. A non-plunge router in a lift is from an operational viewpoint a more satisfactory solution IMO, but it's also more expensive.

Reply to
J. Clarke

I, too, prefer a fixed non-plunge for under the table. Look at the 3HP offerings by either Milwaukee (my preference for a router table router) or Porter Cable. The Milwaukee I have can even be adjusted from above the table.

Brian.

Reply to
Brian

Reply to
Mark L.

The big Milwaukee was my first choice but I am ending up with the Triton. You can adjust height from above the table with the Milwaukee. Is that an advantage? Don't you have to reach under the table anyway to unlock the base? I find that I have to stoop down anyway to look across the table at the bit height.

Reply to
Leon

Huh? Unless you disable the springs, the plunge routers become twice as heavy to lift or adjust under the table. Now if you are talking avout the fine tune adjustments that some plunge routers are capable of making, I agree.

Lets see, Bosch, Porter Cable, DeWalt, Milwaukee all make fixed base routers that have the ability to raise and lower in minute increments if necessary when used in a router table.

On the other hand, the highest-capacity non-plunge routers can swing a larger

And the 1611 Bosch, 1619 Bosch, 3612 Makita, DeWalt 625, and the M12V Hitachi can easily handle wide raised panel bits. These are all plunge routers and some of them have been around since the 80's.

Reply to
Leon

You're right it is harder to use with the springs still in, but if you only have a few different profiles to cut, then the one or two adjustments even with the springs in are not that difficult. I've got a Makita 3612BR and for those times when I know I'm going to have multiple adjustments to make, I remove the springs first and after that, all adjustments are really easy.

Reply to
Upscale

Good comments Leon, thanks. I'll wait a bit to see what your 'in-use' comments are like. From what I've seen though, I'd be surprised if you aren't very pleased with it.

Reply to
Greg Millen

Since you will be lookin fer it, I will report on it ASAP. ;~)

Reply to
Leon

G'day Leon,

Smiley noted ;-)

I like to read comments after the 'honeymoon' period is over, since the two versions tend to differ. For example, a few guys got the expensive Twin Linear router fence and gave great reviews. Over a period of time, I saw some negative comments (scattered in the NG) about the accuracy of the wedges used to offset the fence faces. It's hard to admit to an expensive toy not meeting expectations but, given time, people seem more likely to give the story - warts and all. I'd still like to get the full story on the Twin Linear - if there is one.

cheers,

Greg

Reply to
Greg Millen

You know Greg, I have been buying tools for a long time and generelly buy with confidence. Still I am like you as I know that a lot of hype in the beginning does not always tell the true tale. If you saw my 2 posts about precieion miter gauges earlier this week, I am sure you will agree that buying from a local and reputable dealer is good for him and you. I spent about $140 for a precieion miter gauge that was no better than the gauge that came with my saw. Immediately the next day I returned it and upgraded to a $180 precieion miter gage. Worse than the first and both of these are from reputable manufacutrers. That dealer knows what I expect from a tool and if he sees me coming back, he knows that there is a "tool" preoblem and takes care of it to my liking and without my asking. Today I bought from Woodcraft and paid more than buying on the internet. If I find that the Triton does not fill the bill as advertised, reliably, I have 1 year to return it for exchange, credit, or refund. If I have to return the Triton, I'll upgrade to the big Milwaukee.

Leon

Reply to
Leon

The Triton is certainly a worthy and less expensive competitor.

Brian.

Reply to
Brian

True, but who cares? With fixed base routers, at one time or another you'll be handling the motor to adjust the height. In the case of the Porter Cable

7518 (really the 2nd best option for a table IMO), you've got to spin and spin and spin it to get it to height. Far less convenient than the Milwaukee mechanism.

Speaking of convenience, plunging a router upside down seems to me to be less than optimal. And having to adjust the depth stop constantly would annoy me, although if the Triton has a toolless adjustment that might be better. Does the Triton have a plunge spring defeat mechanism? That would be desireable for use in a table. Though, I guess I just far prefer the ability to quickly coarse adjust the motor to roughly where I want and then fine tune from there than deal with a plunger under table. And the 5625-20 is ideal for that. By far the nicest table router I've used, but of course, not cheap.

Perhaps. But as you noted in another post, the above table adjust isn't terribly advantageous. I've never used it.

Brian.

Reply to
Brian

By the way, here is Pat Warner's take. He's someone to listen to. :-)

Reply to
Brian

Oops, double checked the price. I guess it is no less expensive.

Brian.

Reply to
Brian

Reply to
JGS

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