Fine Woodworking Sees Green - Go Figure

I picked up a copy of Fine Woodworking yesterday and nearly fell out of my chair. Not only did they feature a Grizzly G0500 in their review of jointers under $1,400; they even declared it their choice of eight machines they tested! In a video featured on their web site Bill Duckworth even points out that the Grizzly provided the kind of cut you want in a jointer.

RonB

Reply to
RonB
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And your point is????

Reply to
Duane Bozarth

Just surprised. FWW is a fine magazine but many of their product reports seem to be limited to a rather predictable group of manufacturers. I think they are doing their readers a service when they expand to include other good equipment.

Thats all - surprised.

RonB

Reply to
RonB

I still fail to see why. I believe Grizzly has at least been in virtually all stationary equipment reviews I can recall over the last several years...and I strongly suspect if/when they haven't been, it's because they (Grizzly) haven't responded to requests for equipment from the reviewers.

Reply to
Duane Bozarth

guess I wasn't the only one surprised by that article.

Dave

Reply to
David

I was (mildly) surprised by this result too. DISCLAIMER: I am not "anti-Grizzly." I think they make some good stuff; I've bought stuff from them over the years with varying degrees of satisfaction. But I was surprised to see them earn the "best" prize in this review because, while they often have the best VALUE equipment, they don't often have the very best in terms of absolute quality, flatness, finish etc. This is understandable considering that their equipment is often priced substantially below comparable competitors' equipment. So here's the question this review engendered in my mind:

When FWW (or any other magazine) does these tests, do they purchase the equipment anonymously? It's an important question, I believe, because while every manufacturer is probably CAPABLE of producing a perfect machine, there probably are differences in how likely it is you are to receive a perfect machine, given varying degrees of QC, etc. So, it would seem to me that any manufacturer would do a little extra work to make sure that the jointer that gets sent to FWW, for example, is as close to perfect a specimen as they are capable of producing. Of course, any random jointer off the line might be just as good, or (more likely) might be a little more "off-spec." I don't recall reading anywhere how FWW procures the test samples for their comparison tests. In general, I find FWW reviews to be among the best, and I tend to trust them a bit more than most other magazines. But again, if they identified themselves and their purpose in securing the machines, that would not necessarily mean that I'd discount the entire test result, but it would be another data point that I'd consider in evaluating the test results.

Of course, every other manufacturer presumably would have had the same opportunity to present FWW with their own "perfect specimen," but then that result is a different test; the best each manufacturer is capable of producing, rather than the machine you are likely to get as a result of their quality control standards.

Reply to
bradnh

Bradnh - You make a valid point, and I've wondered that same thing myself when I've read reviews in FWW and other magazines. It is interesting though that FWW found defects in the jointers they did get, however it was they acquired them. The article said that several - at least 4 or 5 if my memory is right - had blades that were nicked and had chunks out of them. They also found tables that needed to be shimed to be correctly coplaner. If the mfg knew they were going to FWW for a review, why would they have let them go out with defective knives, and in a condition that they had to be shimed?

So, it makes me think that they (either the mfg or FWW) somehow just pulled the various machines at random. Like you, I do find FWW's reviews a little better and more believable than some others. I'd really like to get that Yorkcraft 8" - I've seen it at Wilke (near my home). I just have to get my

6" Jet sold first.

Nick B

Reply to
Nick Bozovich

Nick- I'm in the same position as you, which is why I read the FWW article with more than a little interest. I've got to sell my Jet 6" too to make room for an 8" jointer. I'd decided that a jointer is not a machine to try to economize on too much, as the quality of the castings is everything. A few years ago that would have made the choice fairly easy; either a Delta DJ-20, with its cool parallelogram system and excellent castings, or a powermatic. But these days the choice is not so simple; I've read more than a couple of unhappy DJ-20 reviews. This is why, no matter how well the Grizzly scores in any review, I would not be inclined to buy one; it just seems that with any manufacturer, you could get a bad casting, and then you'd have the hassle of returning by shipper. I'd rather be able to just load it back in my van and bring it back for a new one. I don't necessarily think Grizz is any MORE prone to this possibility, but neither is it any less so,and the return hassles are enough to stop me.

I think I may write to FWW to see if they will shed any light on their procurement procedures for these tests. I will report bak if I learn anything....

Nick Bozovich wrote:

Reply to
bradnh

That is a good point that any of us who order from Griz, Amazon or anyone have to consider. I suspect that is why Grizzly has developed a very good support and delivery operation. The initally had to overcome both the mail order and the off-shore bias. Seems like they have done pretty well.

Sideline - My Son-in-Law bought a G0500 and one of their bigger surface planers about 1-1/2 years ago. Since, he has run a house full of victorian base trim and door mouldings across them without a hiccup.

RonB

Reply to
RonB

How odd. They ran a review, and awarded a prize, to what appears to be a discontinued model.

Granted they have to run those things early, probably months in advance, but it's kind of funny that no sooner does the issue come out than that particular Griz model gets moved to the Outlet Section of the website.

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Reply to
else24

That is odd. I just took a look at the '05 Grizzly catalog and it is still in there but it is absent from the main part of their site. I have to wonder if the G0586 is its upgrade.

I noticed a few weeks ago the Grizzly appears to have modified its site. I was a little afraid they had discontinued a couple of hand-held drum sanders I was going to buy. They disappeared from the normal search screens but I could still find them by doing a site search. Ordered them and got them.

By the way, I just did a model number search for G0500 and found it right where you did.

RonB

Reply to
RonB

That certainly appears to be the case. It's the only 8 inch jointer there. Okay, it's the only 8 inch jointer under two thousand dollars. :-)

I bought the 586. At the time I ordered it, the 500 was still there but I wanted the topmount power switch. Got it assembled and running a couple days ago. Everything about it looks solid and well done.

I was going to get one with a spiral cutterhead but decided to spend the extra money on classes and lumber.

Reply to
else24

Reply to
Mike Berger

The fact that they picked the tool they did tells several things:

  • FWW can do objective reviews. Many imports were not all that great in the past. Companies like Grizzly are steadily improving quality while some old guard brands are slipping.
  • Some companies who sell direct may be smart enough to triple check a machine, especially if there's a chance it's going to be a review subject. Companies who sell through dealers may not have that opportunity. The machine that gets reviewed may be their best work, or maybe not.

I wonder if these machines are loaned, purchased by the author or publisher, or blind purchased?

Reply to
B a r r y

I think you are spot on. Oddly, this is the reason why I *would* buy Grizzly. Since I don't own a truck and the nearest serious tool dealer is 60 miles away, no return is going to be easy. I choose my vendor based on who will support me. Grizz has a pretty good reputation for customer service.

Everybody ships a lemon once in a while. Buy from the vendor that will support you.

Cheers,

Steve

Reply to
Stephen M

Just remember...

LOTS of brands are green.

Green in a wood shop doesn't mean Grizzly by any sense of the word.

Reply to
B a r r y

But the grizzly green is a particular shade of green.

And it is not a particularly attractive shade of green either.

I don't know anything about color. But if I was going to put thousnds of machines out there in the world, I would have chosen a different color.

Reply to
Lee Michaels

General comes to mind...

As is General's.

As is General's - again...

PLEASE, no more red. Blood-like colors trigger the 'Oh Sh*t" response in the back of your mind. Something genetically hardwired, or maybe just conditioning. Stop, Danger, Blood - not a color I want on a saw.

How about a dusty greyish-blue. Nothing like Delta's, but not near as blue as Ryobi. Here let me pull up a Pantone Color... ;-)

Cripes, we sound like a group of old ladies discussing drape colors...

Greg G.

Reply to
Greg G

So is Woodtek and it isn't that attractive, either...one wonders who comes up w/ these paint schemes????

I think the Yorktown/Jet off-whites are pretty good, personally.

I have no problem w/ the Delta gray nor the PM gold/green.

Reply to
Duane Bozarth

purple! (tm keeter)

Reply to
bridger

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