.. >On 22 Oct, 10:13, Mike P wrote: .. >> Installing new kitchen. .. >> Floorboards in places crumbling. .. >> Some joists crumbly on top with the usual wee holes made by our new .. >> found "friends". .. >> Reckon it is active as some newer boards have holes in too. .. >> How good is Cuprinol woodworm treatment ? .. >> The main chemical in it is not what is reccomemned on other web sites. .. >> My builder friend advises me to slap the stuf on and put new treated .. >> joists where required next to the old ones. .. >>
.. >> Over what period can the worms destroy a new joist .. years or months. .. >> To me it does not look as though you can wipe the worm out with one .. >> treatment due to the life cycle. D o Rentokil reckon they can? .. >>
.. >> Mike P .. >
.. >Dear Mike .. >You need to identify the problem first. .. >Is it "woodworm" (Anobium punctatum) or any one of many other similar .. >wood-destroying insects some of which cannot reproduce such as Bark .. >Borer (Ernobis mollis). .. >To do this you need either to get someone who has the expertise or .. >follow certain tests with say the frass or size of hole .. >If you were to take photos I would happily advise. .. >
.. >IF it is woodworm then the chances are that it is not active. I can .. >explain if pressed but I don't have the time here. You do have one .. >sound indicator of activity - viz "new" wood being attacked BUT how .. >new is new? .. >
.. .. >Back to your post .. >Floorboards in places crumbling .. >This is not an adequate description to conclude it is woodworm - it is .. >equally true of fire, fungal decay and UV damage! WW normally leaves a .. >spongy mass of tunnels and decay normally is crumbly .. >
.. >Joists crumbly on top .. >It all depends where the sapwood is - send a picture .. >
.. >Usual wee holes .. >Give size and spread .. >age and texture .. >
.. >Deathwatch beetle .. >Powder post .. >House and Forest longhorn .. >Bark Borer .. >Pin and shot hole .. >and many other insects all make holes .. >
.. >What is the frass like? is it gritty and have lemon shaped pellets .. >under a x 10 lens? .. >
.. >How new is new? 50 years or 5 years? .. >
.. >How old is the whole house? .. >
.. >After 100 years most woodworm has died out .. >
.. >How good is Cuprinol .. >
.. >Well Which type? Almost any insecticide containing wood treatment has .. >to have had efficacy tests and will be adequate .. >It is how it is applied that will help. .. >What is the main "active ingredient"? (the main chemical will NOT be .. >the active ingredient which will be at 0.1 or less % concentration .. >The main chemical will be the carrier fluid - proably kerosene or .. >white spirit or pehaps water but unlikely .. >
.. >Wood worm very rarely "destroys a joist" .. >I have personsally surveyed several thousand houses and only very .. >rarely are WHOLE joists destroyed. Well under 0.5% at a subjective .. >guess. What happens is the sapwood gets destroyed and the heart wood .. >remains (generally). It normally takes 50 plus years if it is going to .. >happen. .. >
.. >I have yet in 0ver 30 years to meet a builder that knows sufficient .. >about insect attack in wood so my advice is to ignore any advice from .. >a builder .. >
.. >Why do you think the life cylce affects the capacity to treat .. >woodworm. I don't understand. It is perfectly possible to do so in one .. >treatment and this is the way most treatments are done (except ~Death .. >watch) .. >
.. >The answer to your last question is undoubtedly "yes"! but is of .. >little relevance! .. >
.. >It seems to me that you will NOT want to be putting biocides in your .. >new kitchen after a year or two if you discover it is active and so .. >precautionary treatment is not unreasonable. If you are a professional .. >you will have to do a COSHH assessment in writing to comply with the .. >law .. >If you are an amateur ( I suspect) you will be able to use Class A .. >biocides and follow the instructions on the can. .. >I suggest .. >
.. >remove all struturally unsound timber ( the hammer test is best) .. >replace with pressure treated if joists (tanalised) .. >and double vac (protim) if floor boards .. >
.. >Treat existing retained timbers after brushing down all dust etc on .. >all six surfaces with brush or knapsack spray .. >take all precautions on instructions eg no electrics .. >open windows .. >check for susceptible persons in this property and next door (elderly .. >young asthmatics etc) .. >clear them out for period of treatment and x hours after 8 to 48 .. >depending on chemical .. >use onoly the amount specified - dont over treat .. >dont get it on the oversite if possible - protect with poly first .. >etc .. >etc .. >Chris
Thanx for all that !!
The "new" affected floorboard is about 18 months old.
Cuprinol product contains Flufenoxuron 0.02% Propiconazole 0.06% Hopefully more than just a irritant to make their noses itch !.
Floorboards when split are sort of griity in worst places and full of tunnels.. Some pin holes bigger than others .. on all sides. Fine sawdust on top of joists 2mm deep at worst spots . this is also where you can easily knock off the first 5mm of the joists. All very dry.
House built 1939
Amateur .. ish :-)
Mike P