Wiki - recommended products?

I notice there's a suppliers wiki with comments:

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a hideous can of worms, would it be worth starting one for tools and products[1]?

Or agree to a standard section on the end of any other wiki with recommendations[2].

I know such information is a) biased b) ages quickly, but the same could be said of the Suppliers wiki.

[1] Pros: in one place. Cons: Going to get huge and unwieldy. [2] Pros: right where it needs to be for any subject. Cons: difficult to browse.

I'll go and get my Halon equipped underpants on now!

Cheers

Tim

Reply to
Tim S
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Go for that I think...

For that matter there is a raft load of similar (but ageing) stuff in the FAQ like that:

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am tempted to dump that in the wiki to allow a bit of group wide refreshing - since it probably has loads of stale links by now.

Reply to
John Rumm

John Rumm coughed up some electrons that declared:

OK - I'm game. Might be worth attempting to put some structure in from the get go, eg "Recommended: Hand tools", "Recommended: Power tools", "Recommended: Fixings", "Recommended: Paints, wallpapers and finishes" and of course "Recommended: Misc" as a catch all.

Or the other alternative is one mega page, with another wiki linking to subject headings.

Votes?

Cheers

Tim

Reply to
Tim S

Sounds like a good idea. But... there really is no one recommendation that suits us all. If someone is going to use the thing once a year, a red devil will see them to their grave. If someone does DIY day in day out, its time for dewalt etc. So I'm wondering how you could make the recommendations genuinely useful.

Perhaps rather than recommending you could just include a variety of user reviews on each, then readers see the pros and cons for each tool.

Also, I'd split it into eg drill review, planer review articles etc, otherwise one article is going to grow massive, and for any reader about to buy be mostly irrelevant. The key things to look for can be discussed so that it remains useful in future. A thought anyway.

NT

Reply to
meow2222

Especially if they don't know how to fly a plane.... ;-)

For reviews - yup certainly - keep at least one type of item per article (like we have for SCMS).

I thought we were just talking about "a good place to buy fine faced ply is...." type of lists?

Reply to
John Rumm

I reckon a tool review section would be good. Hard to keep current in some cases though.

Reply to
The Medway Handyman

John Rumm coughed up some electrons that declared:

I was think more specific products, eg Screw-Tite screws are the mutts nutts for application, this brand of crimpers do actually work etc.

But, I see no reason why materials couldn't be included in the scheme for more specialist stuff, eg the fine faced ply or insulation board or particular adhesives for demanding applications. No harm in having a seller website link if the product is hard to obtain and not bothering if it's widely available (Google Products usually sorts that class out and is always upto date).

I agree with NT that we'd probably need one article per type - and that it needs to be a list of products and review-comments by actual owners rather than an absolute list of definitive excellent products. Negative reviews are just as valid, as a "steer clear" warning IMHO.

Not sure if this has any libel-legal implications for the Wiki server and content operators? Doesn't seem to cause other sites any issues, if a suitable disclaimer is added, but as a courtesy, I think this point needs to be raised.

Now, as to namespace issues:

The Article Index doesn't allow for sub folders AFAICS, so we need to be careful not to pepper that with vast numbers of pages which make locating other pages difficult.

The only answer I have is to have a standard article name format, eg "UserReviews_Planers", "UserReviews_Screws" etc. That keeps them together, and mercifully near the bottom of the list.

To make adding new articles easy, I'd go for a pro-forma article that can trivially be cut-n-pasted, eg (but without the example content for the actual pro-forma)

= User Review - Planers =

'''Disclaimer: comments belong to various users of products and do not necessarily refplect the opionions of the owners and operators of the uk.d-i-y Wiki, no liability implied blah blah>'''

== China-Widget ==

=== ProPlaner Mad Bastard Woodeater 120mm ===

  • I have one and it's rough but for smoothing off bits of wood and building timber it's fast and efficient. Blades blunt quickly but are cheap and quick to replace

  • I use one occasionally and it's fine

== German-SuperTool ==

=== PL86 100mm ===

  • Expensive, but very good control, light and accurate

and so on...

Quick and easy to add new sections, not complicated, gives the reader simple basic feedback to assist in their choice. No 1/10 ratings as these are too subjective (inconsistent) to be useful IMO.

Add a forward link to the article from the end of the relevant section, eg Planers and probably have a sub contents page (though folk do sometimes forget to add new pages to these so it may be a chore to maintain)

The other option is to dispense with the manufacturer section headings as I bet most may only get one model mentioned much of the time...

What do you think?

Cheers

Tim

Reply to
Tim S

OK, as a practical example, I just did this:

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we on the right track or can anyone suggest something better, or improvements to the above?

How would it help you in buying a tool (well, ignoring the lack of models above!!)?

Would you find it easy to add comments or new tools (anyone can register to update the wiki)?

Your comments would be very welcome, +ve or -ve, as we hope to use this as the basic template for many more user reviews over the coming months :)

Cheers

Tim

Reply to
Tim S

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Looks good so far.

I can see some logic in using the points raised in the power tool FAQ to highlight how a tool matches the points raised...

So for the Hitachi, you could specify a suitable buying policy that it would be suited to:

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in this case a "top quality" tool.

You could allude to the range

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"High end" in this case

The go through the specific points raised:

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modes (3) Impact energy per blow Clutch? (yup) Weight (2kg ish) Speed Control (probably quite decent) Chisel position lock? Lubrication requirements?

That way we can be a bit more objective...

Me, probably ;-)

I might go slap one of mine in there right now...

Reply to
John Rumm

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>

just the thing, once its populated.

Tim wote:

The current index page is simply a list of every article on the wiki, nothing more. So there's no reason to try to hide anything from it or reposition it. Perhaps one day we'll have a more traditional index as well.

Article headings: How about Screw review, Planer review, SDS review etc. As a reader if I'm looking for screw type info, I'm going to head for 'screw' in the index rather than 'user'

Those are very minor points, altogether a great job

NT

Reply to
meow2222

John Rumm coughed up some electrons that declared:

Done. Now, two things occurred to me:

a) Good idea to mention the specs. Specs are factual, not objective, so I reckon it should come out of the review paragraph and go under the tool model heading. I know it's unlikely that two people actually own the same tool and actually make a comment, but, well, I'm Mr Normalisation (too much database wibbling) - sorry, force of habit. If people contribute and don't follow the pattern, it doesn't really matter, but I'm keen to be able to have a good model page to point them at.

b) I noticed you used several paragraphs - so I tried a tweak to the format where your name (any objections? - it's hardly enforceable) and date of comment is in a mini heading. Again, only useful for multiple comments, but just for example purposes...

I think date is useful as it gives a quick indication if the model is likely to be current or not. Dated reviews are valuable too for anyone buying secondhand.

http://wik

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've done the formatting changes on my bits and left yours mostly alone, to show the comparison.

Votes? (Doesn't have to be my way)

And me.

We need a drive: "Wiki's are easy and people are supposed to contribute directly" :) I think some people are scared either of the "technology" or that there's an inner elite and you have to be blessed before you can touch this stuff. The fact I edit stuff disproves the latter! I've never been elite ;-o

Splendid.

Cheers

Tim

Reply to
Tim S

http://wik

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> I've done the formatting changes on my bits and left yours mostly alone, to

I dont see whats supposed to be compared, unless you mean verbose versus bullet points. If so, I dont see a reason to edit people's submissions.

I think most people just cba

NT

Reply to
meow2222

snipped-for-privacy@care2.com coughed up some electrons that declared:

http://wik

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>>> I've done the formatting changes on my bits and left yours mostly alone,

What I was getting at is that if there's a desire to have a short specification list for easy feature comparison (I agree with this in hindsight), it might be better IMHO to encourage that to be placed prior to the bit where the contributor actually passes judgement. Otherwise it risks replication and it's harder to pick out.

As I said, it's only trying ideas for a model page - I wouldn't expect everyone to be bothered, nor someone to slog their brains out editing everything - after all a quick paragraph with *any* info is worth more than none.

I'm also aware that editing other people's comments starts to infer some liability for what's being said, and I guess we need to try any steer clear of that.

But if a certain simple presentation is presented as a guide, people who care do at least have something to work to :)

In that light do you still feel the style is over structured?

Can't Be ****? Possibly - but like most things, it's a faff the first time (the account registration, getting the hang of the basic format) but after that it becomes easy.

Reply to
Tim S

Yup I agree. It might even be worth putting the list in as a table such that people can just cut 'n' paste it and get a full set of headings. That way they just fill in whatever info they have.

Reply to
John Rumm

tables make editing much harder, and personally I just cant see the point of them in this case. Harder to work with equals less contributions, 2 reasons I rarely use them.

NT

Reply to
meow2222

Harder to work if you are creating them - not so bad if you just copy one (and its laid out with plenty of space etc)

Reply to
John Rumm

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