Where did my water go? (Moved from wrong NG)

Jul 08, 2025 Last reply: 11 months ago 24 Replies

I have a 'Smart' meter on my water supply. I have a softener for the house supply that regenerates based on the amount of water used. The only unsoftened outlets are the kitchen drinking water cold tap, and the outdoor tap, both of which come from the same pipe. Recently, in the last month, the softener's salt consumption has gone up, considerably. I looked at the water meter readings, and they agree. But I cannot think of any change in my water use. The obvious thought is that there is a leak, but where? I can find absolutely no sign of any. The outside tap does not leak, and is shut off indoors anyway. None of the taps are dripping. None of the overflows are showing any discharge. The drains for the washing machine and the dishwasher need power to run water to the drain. There is a cellar in the middle of the house, where I would expect any water that leaked out to gravitate to, but it is dry. The box where the outside pipe enters the house is dry, so no leaks there, and the underground space outside which houses the meter is similarly dry. There is no sound of running water in the softener box, which is right above the entry box. The recorded meter readings give little help, they are sporadic and interrupted enough that trying to correlate high water use with a known event in the house is very difficult indeed. But on a day when I did a clothes wash, and therefore used maybe 80-100 litres more than a 'normal' day, the readings show that I had minimal use! The water company online query system says that it could take up to 10 days to respond to questions. As much as the reported readings are of little help, they do confirm that the theoretical leak is of softened water, and all but 1 run of that is in the house, so would be discovered. Only one run, to the kitchen, is underground, in concrete. I hope that there is no leak there, it would be messy to fix that. And how do I check?



I am trying to think of experiments using selective shut-offs to try to isolate any leak, but the random meter readings reported by the water company do not help detailed analysis. Luckily, as we are in summer, I can leave the supply turned off without worrying about anything running dry and burning out.



Any helpful ideas would be welcome.


Yes, but it is a bitch to see. I even had a passerby stop to help me the other day, and even with a 'smartmeter' photo, he still found it better to just read it, the same as me. I will read it tonight, and work out what to do next. Moving this to the d-i-y NG, where it should have been in the first place.

Have a *very* close look in your toilet pan/s and see if the flush valve is leaking down the back of the pan. It can be almost invisible without laying a sheet of toilet paper on it.

Tim

A listening stick is useful in such circumstances. Still used by water coys when fancy electroic gizmos are available. A large wooden drawer knob fitted to a long metal rod. Ear to the wood and far end on any pipe. With experience you can zero-in on a leak as the noise goes from rumble at a distance to hissy when nearby.

Thanks. I can only try it, and the science is good.

I thought that the syphonic flush system eliminated that? We had that fault several times in the US, but they always had a single rubber flap under full cistern pressure, that seemed to be designed to leak if at all possible. And if it is that small a leak, it wouldn't add up to the volume that I seem to be losing somewhere. I have to be out for medical reasons this afternoon, but I will keep thinking about this, it is really puzzling. And expensive.

pure coincidence, maybe on www, not looked. An hour later BBC South local news had leak listening sticks featured for tracking a water leak of only 12 Litres per day

It's not the flush that dribbles. If the ball valve leaks and the cistern overfills, modern loos have the overflow invisibly going into the pan, not as before obviously dripping from an overflow pipe outside.

nib

Limescale on the diaphragm of the filling valve, or possibly a crack or tear. It's usually some complicated plastic mechanism rather than just a float. If you know what model the mechanism is, spares are normally easy to find.

+1 An issue that I experienced, and I lost more water over six months than I had used normally in more than 20 years. Fortunately Severn Trent took pity on me.

Do you have a syphonic flush? All newer ones are flapper valves of one sort or another.

Tim

This house is certainly not new, it has a thatched roof, and ceased being a pub in 1937. Why have they changed to flapper valves? They leak, as I know to my cost (literally).

Checking my two loos, the downstairs one has a blocked off overflow pipe! So an overfill would appear as a wet floor. Hmm. The float mechanism appears to function well. The upstairs loo has a normal overflow pipe extending through the wall, and there is zero indication of any flow from that. I suspect the softener, but I can't separate the discharge pipe from its holding socket, to see if there is any discharge. I once, only, heard water flowing from it for no apparent reason. I might work on that tomorrow.

Stupid changes in regulations. Probably down to water saving in regular use, without taking account the potential for waste when they go wrong. Overflows always used to have to exit outside so that a failing ballcock overflow was visible. Now it just trickles down the pan, frequently unnoticed.

Tim

I believe that water companies allow you to have one leak that they won't charge you for.

In our previous house our water usage suddenly increased one period (we were metered). I can't remember the exact amount, but it was around

20m^3 extra! The water company found a leak on our property a metre before the pipe went under the wall. It was in a 1" plastic pipe which had been in position for 30+ years, and apparently had been laid on a piece of sharp stone which had slowly worked its way into the plastic.

There are acoustic leak detectors... contact microphones that amplify the sound the water makes as it exits under pressure. Some of the units are thousands -- but Aliexpress will send you a simple unit for under 10 pounds including shipping.

"Water Leak Detector Multi-functional Sound Detector For Pipe Water Leak Suitable for leak detection of various construction pipe"

Or possibly you could shut off the suspect bit, drain it, and pressurize it with air? This to either prove it's not leaking, or hope that the increased leak rate will make the leak more obvious. Rig together a tire valve and some sort of fitting, or buy something like:

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Thomas Prufer

Hmm. At he moment, I don't have a suspect piece of piping, I'm trying to find one. What I did do is to take a meter reading yesterday at 5:30pm, then today and tomorrow I will use water at my normal rate, no laundry or dishwashing. Then I will read it again today, and then bypass the softener. A reading again tomorrow will tell me if the softener being in or out of the loop makes any significant difference. This will either eliminate or point to the softener as the main culprit.

The flapper valve arrangement makes it easy to have a dual volume flush

- part or full flush depending on the user's choice.

Thrills. Many of those that I have used don't appear to work very well.

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