Water Bills

[N. Thornton]

Screwfix Tlc or Toolstation do a mini round blob one that looks much better. Replacing halogens with CFL recessed downlighters would also save a lot.

NT

[mogga]

OK I've had LOADS of probs with my bill since we moved. one bill was for 666£ - about 3 years bills. Then they charged me for the time my old rented place was empty. They've took too much by DD and I will be ringing them up again soon.

[Mike]

housebuyers)

I think it was that guy on Channel 4's Selling Houses who said it. I know he can be a bit overbearing sometimes but he does seem to understand the issues. Of course it depends on the people buying but I would imagine for large families it is most likely to be an issue, less so with couples who only shower.

Do you mean the ones with the handbasin in the top of the cistern ? Some Italian companies have these though they aren't in their UK catalogues as we are perceived to have more than enough water in the UK

Quite agree.

We have a spring and after filtering, storage, pumping and UV cleansing it certainly isn't free :-)

[Mike]

Not quite that pretty though, is it :-)

I'm waiting on those a little longer. I believe the price should plummet shortly so will buy them then.

Y

[Mary Fisher]

That's not evidence though ...

When we were a large family (seven) we didn't have a water meter but did have a gas and electricity meter so we bathed in the same water. We didn't have a shower.

No, they just didn't use ultra-purified water. I didn't think to ask where it came from :-(

Quite. But even if you live in a big city, like us, and use mains water, it has to go through those systems. And, sadly, much of it is wasted.

Mary

[Mike]

I think it's advice you ignore at your own peril

[Mary Fisher]

I'd need more than that and haven't seen anything except opinion.

Mary

[Mike]

AFAIK you're not thinking of fitting a meter so why would you need anything ? Methinks you are playing devil's advocate a bit too much.

[N. Thornton]

re lighting pir:

no, its as good as Ive seen though. Maybe one could stick such a PIR unit inside a recessed light fitting, instead of the bulb etc. Not tried it, and not sure if one could make it look good or not.

At £24 a fitting you might not save by waiting, considering the run cost of halogens. Lets see:

Halogen run cost per 2000 hrs: bulb cost 80p - £5 leccy cost 200kWh @7p = £14 total £14:80 - £19.

CFL run cost per 10,000 hrs: (5x above time) bulb cost 2.99 leccy cost 26w 260 kWh @7p = £18.20 total £21.19 per 10,000hrs = £4:23 per 2,000 hrs.

Saving: £14:77 to £10:57 _per light fitting_ per 2,000 hrs use. I forget how many fittings are in use.

NT

[The Natural Philosopher]

Additional gas bill per 2000 hours to replace lost heat? probably about £5

So £9.23 per 2000 hours in reality.

[Mary Fisher]

Ours was fitted about two years ago. We made our own decision based on the evidence of our own experiences and that of published figures. I wanted to do it many years ago, Spouse was more cautious but he certainly wouldn't return to a non-metered supply. Metering water makes sense.

You're entitled to think what you like - but you have no evidence for that :-)

By the way, we don't have a television so aren't influenced by those who appear on it.

Mary

[N. Thornton]

Fwom:The Natural Philosopher ( snipped-for-privacy@b.c)

Good point.

2000 hours of 100-23w = 2000x77w = 154kWh gas @1.5p/kWh = £2.31

Heating in use lets say 2/3 the year, so the saved money in that is

2/3 x 2.31 = £1.54

Thus real saving figure now:

£13:23 to £9:03 per light fitting per 2000 hours.

Last questions are how many such fittings does it take to light a house, and how long does it take to use the lights for 2000 hours.

NT

[The Natural Philosopher]

How many fittings to light a house? Those halogen spots are pretty small area wise in terms of what they do.

I would say that 25W/sq meter is reasonable. I.e. abourt 2 sq meters per 50W spot. Although we are running at far less than that here mainly.

3000 hours is one third of a year. 10,000 hours per year is an 'always on' figure.

If the lights go on say at 6pm and off at 12pm in any given location, that's a 25% duty cycle - so 2500 hours per year.

As an intereting aside, I have 6x5 meter rooms one of which is teh kitcen,. The Aga fully heats that except on the coldest of nights, at a rated 600W output.

To light it at 25W/square would take 750W. More than enough to heat it completely. In practice is has a mere 520W and dark areas. It's got

9x50W LV halogens and 3x60W candle bulbs.

In an ideal eco world it would probably have 6x25W sstrip lights :-)

But those would really look ugly...

I look forward to hoghly decorated OLED lighting in due course.