Trouble emptying a septic tank

[Peter Taylor]

TonyK wrote

I'm wondering whether it might be worth looking into a hopefully minor alteration to the drainage layout that could possibly make a big improvement.

I guess the reason the EA is saying the septic tank needs emptying is probably because the discharge effluent is not properly decomposed. As I understand things, the organic action by the anaerobic bacteria is severely hampered, if not killed, by modern detergents, cooking oils etc. Would it be an idea to separate the cooking and washing waste water from the sanitary waste water, and direct it to a separate tank in an easier-to-empty position, maybe via a grease trap? That way the bacteria in the septic tank would survive and the tank would probably look after itself indefinitely.

Just a thought Peter

[Tony]

use this stuff and saw a great improvement after the first use.

Tony

[Pete C]

ROFL! you know what 'septic' is in rhyming slang?

The sort of pump you need for emptying is a 'trash' pump and a looong pipe, also have a look at some septic tank FAQ's

cheers, Pete

[Peter Crosland]

Not AFAIK. What does the consent notice say?

[TonyK]

Sounds interesting...

Just to clarify, this septic tank serves a 70 bed youth hostel. Last year all the rainwater was diverted via new drains away from the septic tank so it only has to deal with foul water and kitchen waste. To help with the issue of the kitchen waste a "grease buster" was installed, basically a wall mounted unit which pumps a spurt of a chemical of some sort into the drains as 1am. This I am told will help the tank cope with the oil and fats from the kitchen(s).

I shall have a read of the website, when you say "great improvement" what did it do?

Thanks

Tony

[Tony]

Totally elimated all the smells. Much less evidence of grease buildup. Water on the surface just looks much cleaner. If your drainage area is already blocked up I would guess its too late. We also only use dissovable toilet paper - can't tell the difference when its used but only takes a couple of weeks to totally breakdown as opposed to months. Bit more expensive but we buy in bulk so not so bad.

Avoid the chemicals that kill the good bugs - surprisingly Harpic Limescale cleaner says on the bottle it is safe for septic tanks - whether that refers to not damaging plastic tanks or whether it doesn't harm the bug culture I don't know. We use the ecover stuff for the dishwasher and washing machine.

None of this helps you with the prob of having it pumped out though.

Tony

[Mark]

Oh dear that's an awful lot of C**P to clear.

Oops too late. ;-( Were is it discharging, how old and what type/size is the tank. With that many people using it emptying it alone, is not going to be the end of your problems.

-- Mark

[Tony]

Young people today - don't know they're born. When I used to go youth hostelling, it was a spade and torn out section from the Times. Weigh em on the way in and on the way out and charge em 3 quid for anything excreted. You'll soon be able to afford a processing plant. They need to learn the value of money :-).

Tony

[John]

Try a FLYGHT submersible pump on a long lead. Contact Flyght pumps of Nottingham for info but you can probably hire a suitable unit from a local hire company. If the EA aren't around and the ground area is adequate, it shouldn't create any great long term bio hazard to pump it out onto the grass where sunlight, rain, worms and bacteria will do the business but I'm not telling you that I've seen a 3" Flyght pump propel a plastic fertiliser sack from a sump through a layflat hose - looked like a snake passing an animal through its alimentary canal!

[Pete C]

or even "named the Pump of the Year at the Processing Pumps and Systems Award ceremony, also won the IWEX Innovation Award, the Poleko International Environmental Fair, the VODKa Water and Sewage Fair and the Aquatech Innovation Award"!!!

Layflat hose is a good idea, though with a length of normal you could churn the contents of the tank up a bit before pumping it to the tanker.

cheers, Pete.

[Huge]

Flyght pumps are long gone. And the company that bought them are in France now.

[John Anderton]

I haven't got it to hand so I can't quote the exact wording but basically it says I can discharge into a soakaway as long as the effluent meets certain criteria and the soakaway trenches are at least

40 square metres in area.

They don't seem too interested in checking the purity of the effluent as the consent started last September and no-ones been around to check.

(Given that I live in the middle of a dairy farm, so the fields around are basically one great open sewer, I'm not surprised ! One human discharging 6 feet underground as opposed to 200 cows discharging 4 feet above ground. Which causes most polluton ?)

Cheers,

John

[John]

Considering what is being pumped make VERY sure that the end of the layflat is tied down somewhere. The velocity of the discharge is often such that the end of the layflat tries to move backwards by the reaction of the discharge. This causes the layflat to kink and it then blows itself straight again before repeating the backwards movement. Watching the end of a layflat flailing about a blasting a stream of shit at anything in range is impressive but not to be advised from anywhere in its range

[Peter Crosland]

Thanks for that John. It may be that your local EA man has had a sudden attack of common sense and is keeping well clear (No pun intended!) of the area. Your scenario just illustrates that sometimes the rules make no sense at all. In my case I am installing a subterranean treatment plant because the existing septic tank has given up the ghost. Due to a bizarre chain of events, AKA complete c*ck-up over 40 years and three conveyances by the same firm of solicitors, the tank ownership has not been conveyed to me and the owner of the land in which it is located is not at all happy because he has got to foot the bill for decommissioning it. He is even more irate that he cannot build on the three acres of orchard because two properties including mine have the rights to install new septic tanks and soakaways anywhere within the boundary. Furthermore the tank has been found to be the outlet for another, quite separate, septic tank serving an adjoining property. They are not pleased either because they are going to have a big bill to rectify matters. I believe they will also have to install a treatment plant as well. How wonderful count try life is!

[Peter Crosland]

Since the EA are already involved then you could well end up with a criminal record and substantial fine plus the costs of the clear up. Not a good idea at all!

[Toby]

Sounds like an ideal time to offer him a compromise, I'm sure if you & the other were happy to sell/assign your rights over 2.9 acres to him that would pay for a Klargester a couple of times over.

[Peter Crosland]

I have already told him that I will. He is just not happy with the price I proposed: £250,000!

[roger]

TonyK writes

You might like to consider a French-style "gresoir" - an arrangement for skimming grease from the waste from sinks so that is doesn't reach the main treatment system. Quite primitive construction seems to work OK. With 70 people, you might like to look at the French arrangement with separate routes for grey and foul waste: I hate to admit it, but they do seem to have rural sewage systems well taped.

*********

If anyone wants to read it, I could offer my [fortunately "in absentia"] experience of kindly farmer emptying my septic tank...

[Owain]

"roger" wrote | If anyone wants to read it, I could offer my [fortunately "in | absentia"] experience of kindly farmer emptying my septic tank...

I'm sure it would fit nicely under the Saniflo section in the FAQ

Owain