I was standing on a corner in Winslow Arizona, It was such a fine sight to see, It was Grimly, My Lord..... in a flat bed Ford...Slowin' down to take a look at me.......
I was thinkin' what's he up to?
Well ...At least ya wouldn't hav ta wait till dark
Steve
Hi all ------ I'm back! (But in no way to I resemble Arnold S. )
I said I was going to call the repair man but I'm just no good at giving up!! Needed a break from it for a few days but back with another shot. Nothing at all from the burner nozzle. (Disconnected HT leads and started up in the kitchen). Checked the outlet form the pump, there's a small connecting pipe and absolutely zero. One think I'm noticing is that the pump assembly can move 5-10 degrees around its shaft axis, ie I can waggle it a bit. Now I dont seem to recall this before particularly when tightening the fuel pipe to this assembly.Have I broken something or failed to engage something when I removed and replaced the pump cover by undoing the 2 allen bolts to acceesss the fuel strainer? (Remember it leaked originally after first removal and so i removed replaced and retightened---more this time and no leakage.) Any ideas before I really do have to find a decent repair man? (any contacts welcome who would cover the Hampshire berkshire border area in UK) Cheers Martin
PS I recognise the eagles lyrics (sky) but is the reference to the desert a song or just one of those repply sigs some folks have?)
No, it shouldn't waggle. I don't think you broke anything....But something isn't engaged. Check:
that may help to figure out what happened
As far as I know that's just Grimly's sig....But it was just the way it struck me, that brought out the eagles verse.........
One that I came up with.......The only thing faster than light is your mind......sky
pumps that may help to figure out what happened
thanks, Glad to now I'm not a wrecker! I'll check it out now martin
sky wrote:
pumps that may help to figure out what happened
Well, checked out all the diagrams and refs. form Danfoss and read an informative manual relating to "things worth knowing about oil pumps" No pics at all of my mlsa pump as its superceded. At least I know the correct replacement. ( a BFP21 L3 ref 071NO156) Cant see what I may have done wrong but to me it now looks like the assembly is completely free to rotate and that perhaps this is by design. The attaching of the short outlet pipe providing the only positive location. I'm testing with the assembly out of the boiler and can feel the pump rotating when fan starts. I seem to be getting a better flow rate out of the bleed screw but even after about 10 runs ( 11 secs each before lockout occurs) what comes through my clear plastic pipe seems full of air mixed with the oil. Loads of bubbles and no differnet form the first run today. Of most significance is that in spite of the bleed screw output ( measured as about 33mls in the 11 secs) if i shut the bleed screw absolutely nothing come out form the output pipe. I wondered if it being disconnected was allowing air to be sucked in during the bleed process but even putting a finger over the end made no difference to the "full of bubbles" scenario. I can post some pictures of my dismantled pump assembly if anyone thinks it would help( not used the pic storage sites but I have used a free files storage site. but I can easily understand if the recopmendation is now to get the repair man. Disapointing as clearly it seems I may have messed something up. martin
John wrote earlier:
atomised spray, if the drive is not present then either the drive couplings and shaft are not engaging and transmitting motion to the pumpshaft or the pump internal drive pin is not present and intact. <
Your not letting the pump run low on the feed side, are you? (obvious question that still needs to be asked) What are you using for supply to the pump? A five gallon bucket of heating oil? Is it level or higher than the pump? think about how the oil tank is in relation to the pump when everything is up and running. It's usually level or higher than where the furnace is.
There was also an earlier concern about a pressure regulator, and it might need adjustment, but I would think that would only come into play if you changed nozzle size.
Hi John, I'm still feeding from the tank outside. ( burner assembly on kitchen floor propped up to its installed height of about 10") . I did think about the pressure head however. My tank is at ground level and currently there is oil to about 10-12" above the ground. I wondered whether when I Installed this new plastic tank 5 yrs back and bled everything when it was full this was OK but attempting to bleed and get everything working with a minimal head was giving the pump a hard time. I should state that the flow rate via gravity is still at least what I was seeing out of the pump bleed valve and actually seemed to be more. ( not sure if (I was seeing this with the pipe lowered somewhat from its normal attached position on the pump though). So thats the situatiuon. It ran fine with this set up prior to the initial problem I reported and has worked fine with the oil level just about 3" above the ground. When I went for this ground level set up I thought that I needed a "tiger loop" but my tank supplier stated that the pump was more than capable of sucking oil even with no head. Of course the pipe run is another factor and this amounts to approx 14 metres of 10mm pipe ( just gone and estimated it) Hope this info is useful,
cheers martin ( never like being beaten!!)
martin you need another break, that was me that wrote, not John.
As long as you are getting good flow from the tank, the length of run shouldn't matter. What concerns me is the waggle you mentioned earlier. It shouldn't do that.
Something's not meshed or engaged properly....Sure wish I was there!
I see a red door, and I want it painted black.........Sky
You're right! ( no colours anymore.....................)
I agree it seems strange that the pump body is free to rotate. I may have to do some further dismantling , not of the actual pump but the air vent adjusting assembly Thats all thats between it and the fan housing. It does feel (vibrations) that the pump internals are turning and even if the outlet pipe is disconnected ie pump body free to rotate, starting the fan which drives the coupling doesn't cause the body itself to rotate. ( tiny movement of body only on startup) Just seems to turn the internal gears which must thus have pretty low friction. So I guess I'm thinking even if the ability to rotate is incorrect, if the gears turn internally then pump should pump. Realise this doesn't help my problem.
I've just had a thought, 20 years ago I had a car which lost all oil pressure None was being generated and no oil flow,I was stuck and it puzzled the local techs at the main dealer. Finally head office (general motors -- it was an opel model came to the rescue.It turned out to be a stuck internal pressure relief valve, a spring and ball bearing design. A quick whack of the ball bearing with a drift, (fortunately easily accessible) solve the issue. Now I know a boiler pump has a pressure regulating valve--- have you ever come across these sticking? PS No vehicle or even consumer electronic companies have true technical support avaialble to the public any more in UK -- a sad loss!
cheers and sorry for the name mix up, it was your quotation form John earlier that threw me :-)
A "good" oil pump should be able to pump without a positive head but there is always a risk of a worn pump allowing "drain back" and this often showed up as the unit needing a couple of resets in the morning but once fired would run on and off all day then refuse to start in the morning. I don't think you should have this problem but thats what Tiger loops are there for The age of your MSLA pump is against it. I think you would be well advised to recheck your mechanical drive couplings, check the solenoid is getting
240v to energise it (and has electrical continuity), check the pressure via the test point, and if these are ok but pressure not there, replace the pump. You will need to set the pressure on the new pump and may need to trim the coupling length. Also make sure you get the right direction of rotation (L or R - L is commonest)
Thanks for that John. What actualy does the solenoid switch? I'm assuming it's triggered from the photocell? On my pump I'm assuming its the cylindrical black item with a wire pair traveling back to the control box. it fits via a hole in the middle over a shaft that emanates from the pump cover and the shaft connects to nothing more than a metal disc with a sealing O-ring. Does the solenoid force this disc down on to a lever which cuts the flow or opens a bypass to pressure generated within the pump? I'm just not familiar with these details, thanks for any help! cheers Martin
Just experimenting whether I can post these image links of the dismantled pump and casing for info. Dont worry no image larger than
34kb Martin [IMG]Sorry about the apparent duplicates. First 2 shots just to demo the ability to rotate the pump assembly. Then show how the pump shaft is located within the fan housing, can just make out a circlip, However the raised circular area itself rotates, this would I feel need to be fixed to prevent the pump body rotating HTH martin
martin, my apology on being detained....utterly unavoidable....
In reference to your snapshots:
If you had to engage the services of a Tradesman, I could surely understand....Sky
martin, my apology on being detained....utterly unavoidable....
In reference to your snapshots:
If you had to engage the services of a Tradesman, I could surely understand....Sky
Not sure why this posted twice.
Damm Google.........
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