Screwfix false promises?

If that's your definition of that criterion, then fine, but I have to say that it isn't mine so I don't accept your conclusion.. I certainly wouldn't vote for anybody proposing to increase taxation in any form because fundamentally I don't think that governments should be in the businesses of health care or education, or anything beyond a bare minimum of activities.

Even in that context they are cheap. It's a matter of priorities. Nobody said that it even had to be a new computer. For web surfing, any old thing will do and can be bought for a few pounds at a computer sale.

There are even volunteer organisations who organise computers for the elderly etc.

Not really. I am a regular visitor to the U.S. and the only situations where transactions without a credit card are difficult are if you want to do something like checking into a hotel or renting a car. Obviously they want a means to track you down if you don't pay. However that is true anywhere, including the UK.

If you want to go into a store in the U.S. and buy an item, then greenbacks are just fine.

Ultimately they will have to learn or be helped to learn. You can't hold back progress just because it doesn't suit a minority of people.

If there are a significant number of people who are unwilling or unable to adapt to or use new technology then they will be a market of their own and the smart business person will look at the opportunity and address it while it lasts. In a sense, that is the remaining role of the small shopkeeper. The point is that they had better watch their market because it is changing and disappearing.

Whatever. I was simply trying to pick something that could have been used in the past and now practically can't so the Euro was not a good example.

There are so precious few of those left that it isn't worth discussing.

The trouble is that it doesn't put anything very much of use in my wallet or anywhere else that is of value to me or most other people. If it did, I would mind less.

Exactly. So the town centre shops should focus on doing things that attract people to want to go into a town centre. Most town centres are a complete pain in the bum. It is difficult and expensive to park and a large amount of time can be wasted finding parking. The alternative of using public transport is pretty awful and inconvenient with time and place and one can't practically carry large amounts of shopping anyway.

The shopkeepers should think about and focus on what will make people

*want* to go to the town centres and go to their shops. They are on a loser to begin with because few are attractive places. It's not surprising that many town centre shops are based around relieving the single under 30s of their disposable income, which is why there are so many fashion and music shops.

Of course. That's inevitable. People want to buy some things on price and not quality, artistic or intellectual content. It's the latter three that will be the remaining territory for the small shopkeeper. The other would be convenience, but that is tenuous at best.

If and when that happens it will be because a) customers have voted with their feet and b) that shopkeepers have not made the effort or succeeded in encouraging them to visit their shops. It's as simple as that. Shops will remain as long as there is a demand. If people want to shop at low prices as their main criterion then they go to out of town retail parks, on line or by mail order. You don't need a computer to shop by mail order.

I don't think they are. For the car owner, it's much easier to go to one of these places and park for free. For the non car owner, many of them are reachable on bus routes anyway, so there is no real issue. Again it's driven by the market. Enough customers without cars want to go to shopping centre - business opportunity for bus operator.

If you ask anybody to tell you honestly which they care most about, it is their wallet. It is the main basis on which they vote. After that they may care about public services if they've drunk the government Kool Aid and after that law and order. The most effective way of delivering so called public services is for them not to be public services other than a financial investment by the government from tax revenue into the service of the individual's choice.

I did above. It's pretty simple. Some people will adapt to the progress of technology - there are many silver surfers for example. Others won't. For these people, there will be a market opportunity for businesses that operate outside of technological advance if the numbers are significant.

Ultimately it's always the customer.

This is true, but it is possible for businesses to influence what the customer buys quite heavily if they have the financial muscle to do so.

Ask yourself why people go to online stores. Again it's pretty simple:

- Price (quite often)

- Choice

- Time

- Convenience

The high street stores are simply not competing with that and in some cases can't. They need to provide better/different reasons for customers to visit.

For a commodity item like paint why not? Let's say I want to buy a particular brand and colour of paint. I phone B&Q or any of the others to ask if they have it. When they eventually decide to answer the phone it's usually a call centre who then have to telephone the store and hopefully find a sentient being to go and take a look on the shelf and if I'm lucky have the right thing in the right quantity and be willing to put it under the counter. More often than not, they haven't got all that I want and I end up needing to contact 2 or 3 places to get the entire list. So that's probably the best part of an hour on the phone, and by the time I've visited them all to get the items and discovered that they've got the item wrong anyway, half the day's gone. A complete waste of time and effort.

Alternatively, from home or anywhere on a business trip in Europe or anywhere else, (except at the moment when flying but that's about to change) I can connect to the Internet by high speed network, wireless LAN, telephone or even GPRS and access Farrow and Ball's web site, order exactly what I want and it will be there waiting when I get home at the weekend.

That isn't laziness, it's maximising use of time. To me time is the most expensive commodity, so that's what I seek to optimise.

I can appreciate that some people have plenty of time on their hands. That's fine. They have the freedom to choose where they wish to shop. If there are enough of them then the bricks and mortar stores will remain, otherwise they die. It's that easy.

Reply to
Andy Hall
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So you ARE very much of a "I'm all right, sod you" attitude then, how do you expect people who can't afford to feed and house themselves to afford health care (let alone education for any kids) if it's not supplied by HMG - re open the work houses perhaps ?!...

Sorry but you are either clueless or living on Mars. :~(

Next time you visit the USA, go 'Down Town' and open your eyes, but be careful not to get yourself mugged for the shirt off your back.

Reply to
:::Jerry::::

I hope you don't mean B&Q :-)

Reply to
G&M

You didn't read what I said. I didn't say that government should not make *provision* for health care and education, only that it should not be in the *business* of doing so.

In other words it should not own and operate either system but simply collect the minimum necessary taxation in order to provide vouchers for healthcare and education that people can spend at facilities of their choosing.

This provides a safety net for those who are unable to afford their own services as it does today - any civilised society should do that., It then gives those who wish to supplement what the state provides with their own investment, savings, insurance etc. the ability to do so without additional financial penalty.

As it is today, if I want to educate my children privately, I have to pay for the state system and then for school fees out of net income.

If I want good quality healthcare at a time that fits my requirements rather than those of the government, I have to pay for private health insurance and probably top that up. On top of this I have to pay ridiculous sums in national insurance, as does my employer, and then if he pays for health insurance that is taxed as a benefit with further national insurance on top of that.

Both are an iniquitous situation. I am by no means saying that there should not be provision for those who need it - I am quite happy to contribute to that. I would simply like to have a choice of service supplier and receive back a contribution to it from the government equal to anybody else. I'm not even asking for a return proportional to my contribution. I simply want to have freedom of choice without being financially penalised for doing so.

Neither, actually. The cluelessness is with governments being in the services business and with the belief that they should be. The British NHS is the largest employer in western Europe. A total nonsense.

Any city anywhere in the world has "down town" issues. I visit enough of them.

Reply to
Andy Hall

That attitude is why Screwfix was set up in competition with small retailers in the first place, to provide goods at a reasonable price. As Andy said,if you want to grow your business you need to provide your customer base with the goods they require at a price they are prepared to pay and when they want them. Any market trader knows that 2% of something is much better than 100% of nothing. Tesco's grew to their present size by recognising this and because Jack Cohen knew that he needed help and wasn't afraid to hire it and give the guy his backing. Small retail businesses stay small because the people running them believe that they can get to a stage where they don't have to satisfy the customer and frequently don't survive.

Regards Capitol

Reply to
Capitol

To which I would add, that if they haven't adequate, easy, free car parking, then I'm going to use mail order wherever possible.

Regards Capitol

Reply to
Capitol

Socialist whinge etc!/

If you want to live in a Scottish communist state, please feel free to vote for it. I've seen it close up and note that the most able Scottish inhabitants are all leaving with great speed, many for the south of England. The rest seem to prefer heading for the US which is a capitalist enterprise society which rewards effort, with equal speed. If you wish to spend other peoples hard earned money, don't be surprised when they decide to stop earning. This is now happening in the UK, income tax receipts are dropping and pension contributions are now regarded as a no no.

Tax increases are now predominantly being used other than for the NHS. I note that MPs expenses rose again last month. The sooner we get back to educating our youngsters that if they work hard enough they can get rich, the better and if they don't, they have a very low standard of living. Yes, I do believe in Victorian values!

regards Capitol

Reply to
Capitol

The sad thing is no, theyd been open all the time. The people lived like they were in the 40s, bills must have been minimal, maintance spend was near zero, and I guess the lines they did sell kept them going just about. Anyone in their right mind would have auctioned the distempter off decades ago, and used the space for something that did sell. Same with the tin baths. I think probably half their stock was good to sell, the other half no sane person would buy. ISTR they still had 1970s lino in stock, and this was in the 90s. It did not look good.

There still are a few like that about.

NT

Reply to
N. Thornton

You probably find film companies buy quite a bit from those places.

Reply to
IMM

I think capital is the main issue. A full set of dewalt /bosch /makita kit is kind of expensive, and that capital can sometimes find better uses. In such cases one can end up better off from buying the cheaper tools, even when the tools themselves cost more per human life time.

I think its also fair to say that cheap tools do sometimes last longer per pound cost than the quality brands, I'm not sure its entirely clear cut. If the £50 dangle grinder lasts 6 years and the £16 Ferm lasts 3 then the Ferm works out cheaper per year. Unless youre making a living out of it of course.

NT

Reply to
N. Thornton

good post.

Reply to
IMM

Just moved here actually Jerry! Love it here too. One of our criteria was a village with broadband (or one which would be getting it soon.) I'm worried about your concern for my backside! This morning I've so far managed to get off it to service my wifes' car, drop my son at an adventure day and fit a radiator cover. I've now sat on it again to have some lunch and catch up on some incoming work! Okay with you? Lazy is a bit strong when you've probably never met me, and is the opposite of how most people would describe me. But then I could call you a behind-the-times tosser, and none of us would be any the wiser as to its accuracy!

The point is Jerry, this is not the century of the fruitbat! Welcome to 2004 and technology. I don't have to consider life without the internet because I have it!WHSmith have been living on borrowed time for ages. They're totally irrelevant to most people. Cards are cheaper elsewhere, and most people get papers and mags at their local newsagent or supermarket. By the way, on-line shopping is retail trade! It's MODERN retail trade, it's here to stay, get used to it because more and more high street shops will be doing more and more of their business this way.

I've just looked at later posts and seen how long you've spent writing notes on this (off)topic. I think you've got a cheek to mention my lazy backside at all. You must have Chalfonts the size of grapes the length of time you seem to spend typing! I'm off now to do some proper work, I'm not going to post on this (off)topic again but I'll probably look in next week and see if it's still going! It's been fun, and I'd like to confirm that I do have a credit card and I'm not a relation of Margaret Thatcher, though I did fancy her in a very perverse way when you really got going!

Toodle Pip.

Reply to
Doctor D

That's a matter of personal choice. I don't consider capital to be the main issue at all - it goes some way down the list as far as I am concerned..

One should always consider which factors are the most important. Before I buy something like a tool I consider performance, quality, accuracy, comfort and service. Then I look at total cost of ownership, including the cost of time that would be spent in the event of issues. Finally I consider the capital cost. If at the end of that I feel that the capital could be better employed somewhere else I will reconsider to what extent I am willing to compromise on my five initial criteria. In most cases the answer is not by very much. If I then still feel that the capital is better employed elsewhere, then I won't buy the tool. I would rather go without than buy a piece of junk.

This depends on whether you view capital cost as more important than time. Personally I rate time as being far more valuable in most cases than capital cost.

I don't think that this is the point - it certainly isn't for me. I think that it is too simplistic to only consider purchase cost and longevity.

I don't subscribe to the assumption that DIY time is free, so if something needs to be replaced three times as many times then that adds up to three lost periods of time which could be an hour to half a day. To me, that wasted time is very expensive.

An angle grinder is not a good example because it doesn't need to be a precision tool. If I consider tools where quality, accuracy, performance and comfort are also important such as with certain types of saw, planes, drills, sanders etc. then the situation is completely different.

Reply to
Andy Hall

Bad post.

Reply to
IMM

Bad post.

Reply to
IMM

Coming from someone who is incapable of even selecting the correct tools for a job, let alone the quality; and who is frequently barely able to string a sentence together, that is rich indeed.

Reply to
Andy Hall

Unbelievable. I let IMM out of the twit filter because I think he's served his penance, and he almost immediately responds with lots of diatribe to waste everyones bandwidth.

Plonk. There, I won't have to read his drivel any more.

Andrew

Reply to
Andrew McKay

What tools would these be?

Reply to
IMM

Please put me in your kill file. You are a man of limited intelligence.

Reply to
IMM

If plumbing tools are indicative, almost certainly *any* tools.

Reply to
Andy Hall

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