property developing

[benpost]

since moving into my own place it's not taken me long to be put off by the reality of property developing. while i was still in my parents house i got ideas from watching property ladder and the like that it would be an enjoyable and money making thing to do.

however ive pretty much changed my mind now and i'm thinking i should just keep things simple, do my day job, be able to do financial calculations clearly (as i have regular income and outgoings). my long term aim and a sensible one is to pay my mortgage off early, set a target and check it monthly.

i think the tv programmes make developing look quite glamorous but the reality is different. it would certainly be better to develop a property seperate to your living accomodation as you can shut the door on it and go back to a clean home, however this can only be available to a few with decent capital.

buying to let or renting a room out seems to be the soundest thing you can do as somebody else contributes to your mortgage? even renting a room yourself while letting out your property sounds like it could make sense and supplement your income.

another thing i feel could be important is buying a property you actually like, where i live, looking round, i honestly cant see many properties i'd fancy buying. i live in reading, berks.

what do other people think about this? i find if i can't do something that i want then it stays in my mind for ages as something i want to do but then once i try it it doesnt take long for me to be put off?

[Mogga]

You need to look up rent a room scheme

having the very worse person lodging with you. Then triple it. Even people you know can be horrid to live with.

House prices are sooo silly.

Oldham's average wage is 22k (Stats don't say whether this is including tax credits) and for 115k you can have a flat.

The govt - sorry the BOE - seem determinded to not allow a crash to happen. But the whole economic growth has been on the back of debt and that can't go on forever.

[Anna Kettle]

Thats a bit alarmist. We had a wide variety of lodgers over 10 years and none of them was horrid. Certainly there were some dubious potential lodgers that we turned away but setting some ground rules certainly helps. Also choosing lodgers who have experience of living in a shared house is a good plan

Our ground rules were

Bills were included in the rent. There is no point having to hassle the lodger for more than one lot of money each month

Everyone cleans their own scrambled egg saucepan

I'm sure there was one more, but I forget it ...

As to cleaning everything else, some people (women and gay men) are better at this than others (straight men). Eventually I decided that life was too short and got a cleaner in

Lots of people dont like lodgers who are on benefits but I did cos I got them to arrange that their rent was sent directly from the council to me. I could put up with the delay while the council shuffled paper cos I knew the money would arrive in my bank account eventually

I liked having lodgers, there is always someone around to have a cup of tea with but ymmv

Anna

~ ~ Anna Kettle, Suffolk, England |""""| ~ Lime plaster repair and conservation / ^^ \ // Freehand modelling in lime: overmantles, pargeting etc |____|

[whitely525]

Many people on these programs made money out of the rising market, not their own efforts. But they doubtless got the impression it was all down to them.

If you can't afford to buy at auction and have no trade contacts or skills, it is almost certainly a non-starter. Better would be to just buy houses which require practically no work on the hope of a general price rise. You would probably lose money, but you would save yourself a lot of PITA work.

I do like to see people lose money on these programs, not because I take vicarious pleasure in that, but because it might give a more realistic picture.

[tim.....]

> Imagine having the very worse person lodging with you. Then triple it.

This seems a reasonable thing to want.

Tis a pity that they didn't try to do something about it three years ago when prices could have flattened out. Now I think that they have no chance

tim

[Doctor Drivel]

For 10 years this web site has been saying property price crash is around the corner. I am still waiting. The who runs it is a Jocko lune.

[Mark]

You can still do it. Just start gently. Buy a house that is basically sound but has been neglected. Maybe one that has come to market because of divorce or one that belongs to an old person that has gone to a home. Decorate and spend time on presentation. Nice furniture and interior design pieces will help sell it and you take that with you. Buying price is as important as selling also. Perhaps you could go into rented accom., whilst you house hunt and as a cash buyer with no chain you can lever the price downwards.

This way you can still do your day job.

mark

[benpost]

good points mark, i was lacking a bit of motivation when writing that post. i still find the question interesting of whether to stick to your day job and pay other tradesmen or have a go at things yourself. there is a line to be drawn somewhere there. i know from working with computers that a lot of faults were so basic and anyone with some sense could have sorted them instead of me being called out.

i also realise though that experience is crucial sometimes and you could end up paying more correcting mistakes. i already have my property a 2 bed maisonette and i'm deciding how far i'm going to develop it. for example most of the ceilings are basically sound (no cracks etc) but have a stipple or pattern effect, or have a line where tape was removed. do i get the ceilings re skimmed to make them perfect and flat or just paint to freshen them up.

another one is it worth buying a new oven which fits in with a new kitchen or just leaving a space for the standalone oven i have which works ok? i suppose it depends whether i'm aiming for top wack price selling the place or whether i will rent it out instead.

i'll see how it goes... one minute i'm thinking my day job isnt that bad and i can put up doing it other times i hate not being in control and having to work for others!

[Mark]

Of course you will make mistakes. So long as you learn from it then it is ok. The greater the cost, the more you will remember for next time.

The art of employing tradesmen is to get everything ready so that they can do their 'trade'. Also get them on daywork. That means you can assist during or before. You don't want them to be doing stuff that you can do. For example: You employ a plasterer on daywork. Don't have him stripping wallpaper or pulling down ceilings. Have plaster, pva, scrim etc on site. Similarly with an electrician: Know what you want done. Cut chases in the wall before he gets there etc. Have the electrical work done whilst the ceiling is down.

mark

[benpost]

thanks mark, i'm definitely going to do as much as i can. the way i see it, you can get on and do your day job, not enjoy it, but do the time and pay other people to do jobs on your home. or you can get stuck in, then maybe get stuck, get frustrated, but then instead of giving up go and do some research, buy some tools, whatever it takes to get the job done.

seems like a much more interesting life trying out different things and learning all the time. i'm also thinking long term, if i can make a success of my current property then i can move on to bigger things.

i think i have a choice, do loads of overtime in my job with gritted teeth, or put the effort in to do the work myself.

i'm wondering just how far i can do myself. any one reading this , how far have you gone with diy? where do you draw the line? are there certain trades you will always call in a professional? or can anything be learned as long as you take the time and care?

thanks

[Mark]

Might be better to have the tradesmen in to get things moving. None of them seem like close relatives of Einstein. So most of the stuff you can learn, correct tools for the job and a bit of confidence will get you through most of the jobs. Electrics, plumbing, plasterering, I get a tradesman in, but do the preparation myself.

Tiling, coving, demolition, skirting boards, architraves, hanging doors,kitchen units, digging etc., I do.

mark