Is this cobbled together rising main acceptable?

[Mike Halmarack]

Here in this block of flats, the plastic rising main pipework passes vertically through the airing cupboard of each flat to the flat above.

Since the introduction of water meters each flat has individual pipework, modified from the original. The modification is shoddy and prone to leakage, with significant property damage to individual flats ensuing.

The last plumber who came to fix a leak in the pipework running through my flat said the problem would recur because between the 2 joints in the original black pipework is a section of blue plastic pipe that is of a different diameter. The flexing of the pipework over time causes these joints to leak. The plumber described the blue pipework as being agricultural stuff.

The management company of the flats has a brief to keep the service charges low, which causes them to drag their feet when it comes to repairs, then when damage occurs as a result, the management company attempts to pass the cost on to individual flat owners rather than taking the money out of the service charge kitty.

Despite numerous phone calls, emails and signed for letters the office will not acknowledge the problem in writing or explain why they will not fix it. So my next step will have to be a solicitors letter.

Any thoughts on this problem?

[Chris Hogg]

Only to ask whether solicitors' letters carry any weight these days. Many decades ago, the recipient was supposed to collapse into a quivering heap of jelly and capitulate, but I'm not sure that happens any more. Don't they just get binned?

[Andrew]

That sounds like a bodge. The blue stuff is the correct pipework for connecting a property to the mains supply, but normally just a short length comes into the kitchen, from underground where it connects to the house main stop c*ck.

Your plumber should be aware of the move from black plastic to blue plastic pipework for water supply, because it occurred a long time ago. The black stuff was commonly used in the 1970's but does split with age under certain conditions.

Inside a block of flats, I'm rather surprised that there weren't 22 mm copper risers to each flat from ground level. Were they built this way originally, or was the black plastic piping a retrofit ?.

[Roger Mills]

Can you post a photo showing what it looks like?

Is there now a meter in each flat, or are all the meters in a single location with individual supplies to each flat?

[Mike Halmarack]

I don't know what usually happens to them, as I've never sent one to date. There may just be the continuation of a lack of response as a result of the letter. But if it's worded right it will officially document that lack of response, the unwillingness to acknowledge the problem, and it will ask for an explanation as to why no remedial action has been taken.

Then when I come home after being away for six months and I find the place water damaged, I may have a better chance of financial redress.

[Tim Streater]

Is there a tenants committee? If not perhaps there should be.

[Mike Halmarack]

Thanks for the helpful explanation. I don't know what was there originally. I just know that so many compression joints coupled with stretches of dissimilar pipework has so far been a recipe for expensive damage and shows every sign of continuing to be so.

[Mike Halmarack]

Thanks I'll try to get a decent photo of the situation.

I Imagine that the original single plastic pipe branched off at every flat on the way up.

Since the meters, which are all on the lawn outside were introduced this branching has been replaced by straight patches of dissimilar pipe.

[Mike Halmarack]

Wer'e a bunch of oldies with long leases and joint freehold. The management company was engaged with the brief to keep services charges low, which they are. Getting folks here to do anything much more than getting into and out of (if lucky) ambulances is a task.

[Mike Halmarack]

[tabbypurr]

I suspect your lack of evidence for need for work may be the prime issue. A written letter resulting from a survey commissioned on the plumbing in que stion might be more convincing. It probably would be worth including a cost assessement of doing nothing versus acting too.

NT

[Mike Halmarack]

If regular fixes after property damage in the block is not evidence of need for work, then I thank you for the advice and will look into doing just that.

[tabbypurr]

. A written letter resulting from a survey commissioned on the plumbing in question might be more convincing. It probably would be worth including a c ost assessement of doing nothing versus acting too.

People are often wilfully stupid/blind when asked to pay. A suitably qualif ied plumber's survey could end their opportunity to do that & expect to get away with it.

NT

[Andrew]

Then where does this orphaned pipe actually go ?. If your meter is outside then a separate supply must have been installed to each flat, with all the disruption that this would have entailed.

I suspect the pipe with patches supplies the top flat, while all the floors below have a their own dedicated supply from their own meter. If so, it is the responsibility of the person on the top floor to have it replaced with a continuous run of new pipe.

[Andrew]

But does this pipe supply water to your flat ?.

Do you have a photo of the pipe that connects to your stopcock inside your flat ?.

[Andrew]

If the whole vertical run of this pipe is not mechanically supported then the compression joints will be constantly trying to pull themelves apart, which is not good.

[Mike Halmarack]

I see what you mean. As I understand it the management company is responsible for the services, the maintenance of which is payable from the service charges to the whole community. It seems this charge is kept low by the management company failing to maintain the services, then when damage occurs laying the cost on indivdual flat owners. This is comfortable for the general population and painful for the individual.

[Andrew]

You didn't answer the question though. Which flat is connected to this patchwork pipe ?. why wasn't a new run of blue plastic pulled through to replace it ?. Sounds like penny pinching to me. These are the questions you need to find answers to.

[Mike Halmarack]

[Mike Halmarack]

Apologies the patched pipework does supply the top floor flat.

But the management company is responsible for the services and if they fixed it properly the recurring problems would end. It would be a tricky business for an individual flat owner to be responsible for services running through other peoples flats. That's my understanding of why the management company exists, to take such responsibility.