Is a TV bolted to a wall portable?

I currently supply an LCD TV for tenants.
The Scottish Gumint has decreed that the electrical apparatus in let property must in future be inspected (both PAT test and comprehensive wiring check) by an accredited electrician (which seems likely to mean 'an electrical contractor large enough to afford it', and likely to exclude individual electricians).
This inspection is to take place every 7 years, but you can predict a rapid reduction to 1 year when the number of electrical problems doesn't fall, or perhaps even increases (it's a fair bet that there are more problems with wiring which is new rather than years old).
Nothing I can do about the wiring check, which I imagine will mean condemning anything in a metal box, anything with rewireable fuses, anything with rounded edges, and any small cable whose conductors are stranded. And certainly steel conduit in a house, because that'll be far older than the 19 year old new hire sent by the accredited employer.
I can remove all portable appliances, or sell them to the tenant (tenant's own equipment, which I've sometimes found to be dangerous when they leave it behind, is excluded from the test requirement, as "of course" are Council properties).
But what about the TV which is bolted to the wall, and which I think may be a a desirable item for a tenant? Is that 'portable'?
The only sensible thing I can see in the regulations is a suggestion that RCDs are a good idea - but that's not even a requirement, just a suggestion.
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On Sat, 25 Apr 2015 09:10:52 +0000, Windmill wrote:

Unfurnished on an AST (or whatever the Scottish equivalent is)? Or some other kind of tenancy?

If all landlords are going to be required to test all equipment, then you can bet damn near all electricians are going to get themselves signed up to be able to do it...

Can you imagine the headache if you, landlord, were held liable for every single piece of electrical equipment that the tenant ever brought into the property...? Utterly unworkable.
If you "sell" the TV to the tenant, then you're going to be buying a new TV with every tenancy.

If it's "portable", does that exclude it from the testing requirement?
Have to admit, if this is an unfurnished AST, then I'd not be providing a TV. Seems way OTT to me, and just makes a headache. By all means, provide a wall-mount VESA bracket for them to mount their own flat TV on, but...
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No, a Short Assured Tenancy on a flat that's fully furnished so that a tenant can move in and have most of the things he/she will immediately need.

May be difficult though.
And God help tenants when landlords are forced to raise rents to cover the cost.

They might just try it though, given enough time.

Or not providing one.

Times were tough in 2008/9 and the TV seemed to help in finding tenants. The alternative was to pay a hundred pounds a month in Council Tax for an *empty* property. They keep changing the rules; latest is that you pay double if the flat remains empty for too long. Fascist bastards.
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On Sat, 25 Apr 2015 18:37:30 +0000, Windmill wrote:

Ah, yes, that makes a TV pretty essential.
Just bite the bullet.
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I'm already heating only one room in my own house. How much harder do I have to bite? Or should I just do a Rachman?
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On 25/04/15 10:10, Windmill wrote:

Just test it.
"Portable" is a misnomer anyway.
The formal name is:
In-service Inspection & Testing of Electrical Equipment
The point being, you would normally inspect and test a TV. The fact it is installed makes no difference to the validity of such a check.
The test part is pretty meaningless on Class II equipment anyway (there is not much you can usefully test in service, as opposed to type testing at the factory).
But the inspection part, particularly of lead condition, plugs and fuses are very well worth doing.
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At present I do things like that myself, more or less automatically, but I'm now going to have someone, probably a young guy who's a recent hire (maybe even on a zero hours contract) who'll want to find problems that aren't there.
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On Saturday, 25 April 2015 10:18:24 UTC+1, Windmill wrote:

or anything in a plastic box after Amendment 3.

Of course. Have you seen the standard of council house rewires?
Owain
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snipped-for-privacy@gowanhill.com writes:

No, but I can guess, based on the reports I see of their performance in other areas.
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Usually way OTT with their spec
Only RCBOs are allowed by our local council - no split load CUs
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On 26/04/15 10:46, ARW wrote:

Might be a bit for forward planning - if they spec metal CUs too, they are probably golden for the next couple of Editions of BS7671!
Some newbuilds in China were using all RCBOs about 5 years ago when I last went - quite impressive. Especially considering the Mao era stock had a a tiny supply (20A? - was very small) if you were lucky... Just enough to manage an electric shower - the sort that heats up a small tank for 30 mins before you want a shower, usually plugged in to an extension lead tied over the shower curtain rail!
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On Sunday, 26 April 2015 10:47:00 UTC+1, ARW wrote:

But the actual standard of wiring may be rather lacking. I suppose when you've got 2 days to rewire an occupied house a little finesse is lost.
I've seen T&E entering re-used imperial conduit with no bushing on the end, and a couple of weeks ago a new CU in a landlord's cupboard left without blanks on the unused ways.
Had to laugh -- this was for a door entry system installation. I asked the council electrician "are you wiring the power supply in *this* cupboard because I think the door entry installer has put his power conduit over in *that* cupboard?"
Response was "there's nowhere to take power from in *that* cupboard as it's all TV distribution gear". (Which is powered from a nice handy switchfuse and 13A socket of course.)
Nothing that couldn't be solved with another 10 metres of galv conduit snaking over the ceiling by the door entry installer.
Owain
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On 25/04/2015 10:10, Windmill wrote:

ISTR that 15 - 20 years ago there was a problem in the school where I worked in testing Baby Belling cookers plugged into a 13A socker. The type of element used had too high an earh leakage current for the item to pass. They were then connecter to a switched fused spur obviating the need for testing as they were no longer portable.
I know that there are flaws in transfering this logic to your situation 1 the regulations mey (probably) have changes 2 Your TV would still (possibly) be portable as the cable will plug into the TV using an IEC connector
Any thoughts from the experts?
Malcolm Race
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Malcolm Race wrote:

Then their Advisors were completely wrong, as there is very little mention in the 'Code of Practice for In-service Inspection and Testing' of 'portable' against 'fixed' equipment, they both should be assessed to see if they require Inspection.
All appliances/items that are liable to be damaged must be inspected, And it isnt, contrary to popular belief, annually. It can be every week, or every 5 years. Each appliance/item should be risk assessed to see what Inspection Regime it should have. A portable drill on a building site may need to be inspected every week. An oven in a domestic house may need it once every 5 years. Also, the Inspector/Tester does not recommend when the item should be inspected - that is down to the customer/duty holder.
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If the tv is on those keyhole shaped holes, then I'd say it was portable, but does it have a handle and how far down the elf and safety pit do you want to go. One migight suggest that anything with a removable plug to the mains is, more or less portable. I have a portable coocker, but its clamped to a piece of worktop, is that portable, who knows.
Sounds to me like making work for the working man to do at the expense of the landlord and the increase in rent that this will generate. The biggest problems in rented accomodation tend to be badly maintained gass appliences that generate carbon monoxide. I'd strongly suggest a monitor for this is in all flats and houses with gas appliences.
Its just aseasy for a rat to chew through a modern cable as it is an old one in my experience. Brian
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The tenant should be the one dictating what gets tested, after all he lives there. If he wants something to be safe, he can inspect it himself.

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In principle, I agree. But for one reason or another, some don't tell me when there's a problem. Perhaps because they think they should cope with things themselves, or because they're afraid I would blame them (usually I wouldn't). So there's an argument for testing; I just don't trust the government to set sensible rules. (Why would they change now?)

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No there isn't. It's their problem, they need to tell you or fix it themselves if they think there's a problem. It's them that has to live with it. And if you want your property less likely to catch fire, then by all means go have a nosey once in a while. But the government should have nothing to do with it. They don't make us test stuff in our own home, there's no reason for a rented property to be any different.

Governments and councils are entirely staffed by utter morons. I'm not sure how this came about, but if we just blew them all up and started again, maybe we could make a decent country out of the UK?

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I've often thought that one part of the reason for German success is that so much of the previous bureaucracy got blown up! A heavy price to pay, of course.

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