Improvised fence ideas

[Glen Able]

The 20' long wooden fence at the bottom of my garden is not going to survive much longer, as it backs onto a narrow public footpath and is often subject to vandalism. (They seem to like kicking the fences and yanking off any bits they can).

I'm trying to devise a robust replacement fence. A complication is that there's a mature hawthorn (+ a smaller tree) only just inside the boundary - the current fence has to bulge outward nearly a foot to get around the tree - so I guess a concrete block wall is probably not a simple option.

I'm thinking about putting concrete posts in, which should be pretty indestructible. I'm not confident to use massively heavy concrete panels, so I'm wondering about making wooden panels, say 5' x 1', which would slot in easily - with the big advantage that any that do get damaged can be replaced very simply.

Any thoughts on whether this is a reasonable idea, and (if so) what materials/method would be good for making some sturdy panels?

thanks for any help! G.A.

[andrewpreece]

I have had fences made of sawn elm, and they are pretty tough. I'm talking about hardwood that has been cut by slicing a tree into 1" ( or so ) slices which are then cut to length and nailed to posts ( wooden in my case ) shiplap style: the edges of the slices are wavy so can't be easily butt-joined in the way you are thinking of. It is necessary to visit a sawmill to get this kind of stuff, but it lasts forever and would be very tough if assembled well and kept to reasonably short sections ( 5' sounds fine ). I don't know if elm is necessarily the only choice, I imagine it's in quite short supply after he Dutch Elm disease disaster of the '80's, my fences predate that. It looks rustic too!

Andy.

[Rick]

A possible insane suggestion, that might work, Pile up concrete railway sleepers, 50 pence each off ebay.

Also look at fethercrete, its the same shape size, a bit more expensie, and half the weight.

Rick

[Brian Reay]

Had a similar problem in our last house.

I made a close board fence from 6x1 sawn timber- not cheap but not silly money either- 6ft high and I added extra posts so they were about 3ft apart. Top was 'zig zagged'. I made up 6ft wide panels and fixed to rails between the posts (the intermediate posts were set back, hence still working in 6ft panels).

If I were doing it again, I'd just put in the rails and plank it in situ, using a guide to get the top level.

I used screws (bought in bulk) rather than nails as I wanted it solid.

Ours was about a 35ft run and (about 12 years back) cost around £180 in materials.

Never had another problem with vandals and it still looked good last time we walked that way 10+ years later.

[Mike]

Well I looked and I can't find any. Can you give the url of some as at that price I'd have them.

[Rod Hewitt]

"Brian Reay" wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Last fence I made, albeit quite small, I used stainless steel screws. I really dislike the rusted nail or screw streaks that otherwise appear.

[Glen Able]

Nice. Any way to achieve this with concrete posts, or could timber posts survive with idiots trying to boot the whole thing down all the time?

Another thought - would the timber gravelboards that you see in Wickes etc. do a reasonable job if you used them for the whole height of the fence rather than just the base?

cheers, G.A.

[Glen Able]

This sounds good, too. Although are rails a bit of a weak point (i.e. snap at the end easily) when your fence gets a vigourous kicking? Actually, if I used concrete posts, could I fit rails between them easily? In particular I'd want a rail along the top where the rascals like to reach over to grab the top of boards to pull them off. I wonder if a few spiky branches from the hawthorn could accidentally get attached to the rail too :)

thanks, G.A.

[Mary Fisher]

I live in a high crime/vandalism area of Leeds. Strangely, we've personally had very little trouble but I have noticed that some others' timber fences and features have been burned. It sometimes seems that if the miscreants see anything as a challenge, if stout boards are protected by prickly growth perhaps they might think of another way to damage them.

They have to be able to think of course ... :-(

We have the houses of another street backing our houses so don't have the problem but a nearby ginnel is being closed to the public, depriving local people of an easy route to school and shops. This is because those people whose houses back onto the ginnel have had terrible problems for many years. Their rear boundary fences or walls have been damaged, wrecked and defaced no matter how they've been constructed. The most secure seem to be made of concrete blocks with concrete piers and, in one case, buttresses (illegal I know) which protrude onto the footpath. Also illegal are the over 2m high walls and broken glass on tops of walls. Most of the stone from original (C19th) walls has been stolen. The resulting mixture of styles, building materials and levels of care is a mess.

But what do you do (apart from try to sell) when you're harassed at all times of day and night? Bollards at the ends of the ginnel have been broken down for years, to allow motor bikes and even cars to be driven down (and get stuck!) Add to that the lack of cleaning of dumped household stuff and general litter (I've monitored leaf fall which has accumulated for years) despite constant promises of better services from the council and it makes for a dangerous place to walk through as well as awful for neighbouring households.

This ginnel represents a worst case scenario. I don't think many places are as bad but I do have sympathy with people in similar even if less serious circumstances.

Mary

[Mark Trueman]

I recently had a problem with vandals kicking in my fence, which was falling apart as it is. I just replaced it with a new one, nothing special, just wooden posts and panel fencing and they dont even attempt to kick it in any more. Whether they just got bored, of if the fact that it is a new fence and there was some kind of psychological factor due to the fence being new, i dont know..

Or maybe it was the second row of fencing i put behind the first that had nails through it. Kick that you little scrots.

"I was just testing my new nailgun orficer"

Disclaimer: I in no way condone the use of nails, anti vandal paint, sharp implements or viscious animals in order to get rid of vandals

[Mary Fisher]

!!!!!!!!!!

Good job I'd finished my coffee!

[Mark Trueman]

The thing about electric fencing is that the little buggers like to push their mates against it. Good for a laugh (for them especially), but unless its solid electric fencing and not that flimsy pasture stuff, you may have problems The weight of "the frying chav" as he falls on the fence and burns another pattern line across his burberry jacket will bring the whole lot down.

One funny story though with regards to the erection of my new fence. The old fence used to run across the top of a small wall, about butt height, with the posts fixed into the wall itself. When i replaced the fence, i attached the new posts with big old bolts to the inside of the wall (a very successful method if i do say so myself). However, now the chavs tend to sit on the wall on the other side of the fence and eff and blind on the summer evenings. Anyway, i digress.... At the same time as putting up said fence, i was also levelling off an area behind the fence for a new patio, and had placed levelling pegs at regular intervals. Now one evening the chavs were sat on my wall and all i could hear were profanities, anyway, the wife peered round the corner and rolled her eyes at me, as if to say "bloody dirty chavs" ( a common phrase around here). Anyway, i proceeded to demonstrate my annoyance to my wife by picking up my spade and acting out a "running towards the chavs with spade ready to impale them" type of action, of course they couldnt see me as they were the other side of the fence. However, they did hear me..... when i tripped over one of the levelling pegs in my garden, and flew towards the fence face first. I dumped the spade just in time, before it went through the fence into the back of some burberry capped plonker. I smashed into the fence at some pace, face first, nearly broke my neck. But god did i scare the sweet bejesus out of the chavs. I was then on the receiving end of a good old bit of abuse i can tell you.

"Bloody hell, what the hell was that you ****, I almost broke my Elizabeth Duke chain you ****" Unfortunately the wife witnessed my embarrassing moment and now the whole family knows about it.

Most said i should have kept the spade in hand.

[Mary Fisher]

Ah. So there's no point in not advising it ... :-)

[Mary Fisher]

Sorry - hit send too enthusiastically!

Nice story and 'most' are right.

Perhaps something not visible but very odorous might stop them sitting on the fence? There must be a use for all that illegal creosote in the shed. Or Renardine? Use your imagination ...

Mary

[Alistair Riddell]

How about that non-drying anti-vandal paint? Or just axle grease?

[andrewpreece]

I wouldn't necessarily go with timber posts, not because they can't take the punishment, but because they can rot where they meet the ground: this is a perennial topic, and people argue both ways. I have no experience of the gravel boards at Wickes, but this could be a solution - as long as they are thick enough. I take it you will be using concrete posts with slots? The shiplap construction I'm talking of possibly won't fit in these slots, unless the slots are twice the thickness of the sawn timber, i.e. if the timber is 1" thick, a slot >2" wide would enable you to use the overlapping construction I had in mind - it strengthens the fence too, as the overlaps add to the strength. If the slot is too narrow, perhaps you could screw wooden battens to the concrete posts, and fit the fencing timber to that? I'm so glad that I live in a quiet backwater!

Good luck,

Andy.

[Rob Morley]

Galvanised or sherardised fasteners are probably more appropriate.

[andrewpreece]

Glen, I was in Wickes today and had a shufti at those gravel boards: although not ideal, they could well do. It occurred to me that if you use those concrete posts with the slot on each side, that'll probably be a 2" slot to be able to take a fencing panel. Now the gravel boards are nominally

19mm thick, so if you build them up in the slots one board at a time, lap jointing them together ( i.e. overlapping by about 2" ), you will get a structure that will fit the slots nicely, without rattling about. Nail/screw each board to the one below, ( how many fastenings is up to you) with the correct amount of overlap ( circa 2") and build up to the full height that way. The lapjoint construction benefits you as it (a) makes the fence stronger (b) there are no gaps for people to peer through, and (c) it will (probably ) fit nicely in a 2" concrete post slot.

Just an idea,

Andy.

[dmc]

of a fence though at 4 per ton :)

Darren

[Rod Hewitt]

Rob Morley wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Possibly, but the ones I used have happily stood up to gales and they and the fence still look (nearly) new. Must admit, the preservative doesn't stick to them very well.