Heat pumps - ThisIsMoney

[alan_m]

It shows an average COP of 2.5 to 3 for heating water to 50C (not the legionnaire cycle) in mild September weather. That COP figure is likely to drop during colder winter weather and when the need for CH kicks in.

His costings include 5p/kWh for one hour at night (now 12p/kWh for 4 hours duration) but he needs to factor in that he will need CH during the day/evening and that same tariff is 9p/kWh more expensive than the standard variable rate from the same supplier. Give it a few years when more people have electric heating and are charging their EV overnight there may not be a cheaper overnight rate.

[Brian Gaff]

I know they use them a lot in New Zealand, but there the sheep outnumber the people, which in many cases means there is a lot of land about. I think before I'd jump in over here, I'd want to let the first adopters make all the mistakes until there was a case or not for installing them. you don't very often get something for nothing, and I'd suggest just like everything else, Heat pumps are the same. Brian

[alan_m]

£1500 for 3kW (excluding fitting/connecting and any ancillary equipment needed)? The first couple of minutes shows fitting batteries on a solar system

Also, I wonder why he was continually

Was this the same property in which he installed two gigantic radiators for less than 2Kw output, with a 40C flow? The vertical radiators just fitting in the alcoves either side of a chimney breast?

[David]

In NZ the majority of the population is concentrated in a very small area. In Auckland, for example, sub-division has been all the rage since the

1980s. That is, you build a couple of new houses in your back garden and share your driveway. A lot of houses are within touching distance - that is, go to your boundary (close to your house) and you can touch the wall of your neighbour's house with a short stick. Often on at least 3 sides of your property. NZ doesn't have much mains gas and has cheap electricity (lot of hydro and thermal) so all electric heating is common. Where they have heating, of course. Still a lot of "put on another jumper and stop grumbling". Also a lot of damp, mould, and sickness of course. Plus legislation about "leaky buildings" with no insulation and lots of draughts and water ingress.

Guess who has visited NZ recently?

Cheers

Dave R

[alan_m]

There is enough evidence to establish that they can work well even in then UK. They do need to be installed correctly and for the average UK old home an improvement to the insulation and perhaps a change to existing CH infrastructure is also required.

[Max Demian]

What do EPC inspectors do? They just measure the rooms with their laser gadget, tick boxes to say whether there's double glazing or loft/cavity/floor insulation (if they know - usually they don't); count the energy saving light bulbs and make a report.

My latest one was just a copy of the previous one - no-one came round. It said that there were individual gas heaters when there is gas central heating. I complained and they just sent an amended report.

[RJH]

You'd like to think. A close friend - an environmental scientist no less - had an ASHP installed recently, a day before the deadline for a hefty grant. Insulation-wise, it's poor - thick stone walls, solid uninsulated floors. It was all tail wagging dog. He says he's going to improve the insulation at some point . . .

[RJH]

Oh OK, interesting, thanks.

[Max Demian]

In an ICE car the compressor is powered by a shaft through a seal, and no-one has invented a perfect seal for these conditions. Electrically powered heat pumps can be perfectly sealed as the power goes in as electricity, which is why domestic fridges can last for decades without attention.

[Max Demian]

I don't quite understand why houses had fireplaces in every room for a period. Only people with live in servants would have the fire laid in bedrooms, and even then they would only light it to get up. Theoretically sick rooms would be heated but I was never sick enough as a kid.

Later only the main living room would have a fireplace and maybe there would be an electric bar heater in the dining room. For other rooms people used paraffin heaters sometimes.

[Max Demian]

Much better than sheets and blankets as "making your bed" is just a matter of straightening out the duvet.

In cold weather you just use an extra duvet, either in its own cover or clipped together in the same cover. Usually duvet sets had a 9 and 4.5 tog duvet.

It took me some years to work out how to change the cover easily, by turning the cover inside out... (Actually taking the cover off to wash usually turns it inside out.)

[Robin]

As I've commented before, simply sticking insulation on Victorian houses with solid walls and suspended floors risks rot. And often can't be done externally without moving windows and extending roofs. I won't believe the estimated costs cited by the likes of the Climate Change Committee until they come up with specific, audited examples of the work being done and the final price.

[The Natural Philosopher]

But that is only on account of 'reneable energy' In France and in Sweden they often don't bother with heat pumps because nuclear and hydro electricity is about 10c a unit

₣reeze your earthworms

[The Natural Philosopher]

Before WW2 we called then 'eiderdowns'.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Its not a matter of construction., Its a mater of a harsh environment. Salt spray rots the radiators (condensers) and aluminium pipes typically, and the O rings and other seals are subject to constant flexing. They are also fairly high power in a small space.

[The Natural Philosopher]

They did it because that was the neatest to central heating they could get.

And no, they lit it themselves.

And I light the fire in MY bedroom before I go to bed.

That was how my parents 50s built house was equipped.

[S Viemeister]

When my great-grandfather rebuilt the family home for his second wife, he installed little fireplaces in the two big bedrooms (nothing in the little ones), a big black open-fire range in the kitchen/main living area, and a fireplace in the living room. No plumbing, though, and no electrics.

All the fireplaces are gone now, but there's a wood stove in the living room. Oh, and plumbing, electrics, and heating have also been added. The place has been in my family for 6 generations - a cousin has it now.

[Jeff Layman]

I can't stand the things. I find that they leave me too hot or too cold. I first came across one in Reykjavik in 1969, and wondered what it was - why was there an eiderdown on the bed and no sheet or blanket? :-)

[Adrian]

In message [e-mail], Robin [e-mail] writes

It doesn't even have to be as old as Victorian. My current house was build in 1939. The front is cavity walled (not sure how wide the gap is). The side and back are double skinned with virtually no gap. A couple of the neighbours have had external insulation done in the last year or so (4" or 6" of foam stuck on, then rendered over). Looks OK, but when you have a closer look, the end walls now sticks out beyond the gables, so no loft ventilation there, and I suspect it would block a fair chunk of any soffit vents. I haven't spoken to them yet to find out what it cost (assuming they'd say), and if they've noticed any problems from it.

Adrian

[nothanks]

I get unreasonably grumpy when I have to get a duvet into its cover - if only they had poppers on 2 sides it would be soooo much easier.