Electrical wiring in shower enclosure

Hi,
I need some advise on how I can run electrical wires within a shower enclosure. Currently I have a shower and toilet on the ground floor of my house. There is a mascarator for the toilet which has its electrical supply wiring running along the surface of the wall in a protective conduit. There is also a high rated juntion box to make the connection to the wire for the macerator.
I've had conflicting recommendations from two NICEIC electricians / testers. One has said that the wiring has to be sunk into the wall and tilled over. The other electrician has said that there is no problem with the wiring being surface mounted, but it must be encased in a high impact waterproof truncking.
Does anyone know what the definitive regulations are relating this please - quoting the reg this concerns would also be a great help as I can then quote it.
Many thanks
D.
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On 19 Mar 2007 03:28:18 -0700 someone who may be "DB"

Simple. Unless they are feeding equipment within the enclosure it is not allowed to run cables in the enclosure.
If you mean the room the shower is in, then it depends which zone the cable is to be run in and what it is feeding.
--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
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wrote:

Hi David, many thanks for your comment.
The shower does't have have any panels. It has a shower curtain which actually encloses the toilet as well. The whole thing was put in by concil contractors a couple of years ago (before I bought the place). The wiring at the moment is within the shower curtain (as is the toilet).
So as you've put it, does the curtain mean that the toilet's macerator is within the enclosure? If this is the case and therefore the wiring is feeding equipment (macerator) within the shower enclosure I take it that surface wiring is acceptable.
Is there a specifc reg (Wiring regs) that that your response refere's to David? If it's acceptable (from what we've said), does the wiring need to be encased in waterproof conduit or anything else for that matter? Are the regs specific on this and if so which ones?
Many thanks
D.
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On 19 Mar 2007 04:56:24 -0700 someone who may be "DB"

You mean that the whole floor is used as the shower tray and the toilet sits on this? Not good for toilet paper.

The regulations are based on the area of the shower tray or bath. If there is no shower tray then they are based on a distance from the fixed outlet of the shower.

The Wiring Regulations, in particular the amendment of 2000 or 2001 in relation to rooms containing a bath or shower.
--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
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wrote:

Hi David, the whole floor is a wet floor with an eletrical drainage pump. do you know what the distance away from the shower the toilet has to be to qualify as an electrical device within the shower enclosure?
These rules leave a lot of grey area to sort out as I'm still none the wiser if I can have surface mounted cables for the macerator in the shower area. Any definitive help is much appreciated. (Especially if you can quote the actual reg). It's difficult being a layman or homeowener in this situation as different NICEIC qualified electricans have come up with opposing suggestions - so a defacto standard written reg would be the best way to resolve this cunundrum I feel. What do you think?
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mused:

Heh, defacto and BS7671 don't go together. The regs are as vague as possible for some reason.
--
Regards,
Stuart.
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On Mon, 19 Mar 2007 21:04:05 +0000 someone who may be Lurch

No doubt that is the way the international committee wants the wording. It goes well with the less than useful arrangement of sections.
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David Hansen, Edinburgh
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David Hansen wrote:

And allows the IET the opportunity to publish all manner of lucrative supplementary materials.
Owain
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On 19 Mar 2007 07:43:10 -0700 someone who may be "DB"

0.6m from a fixed shower rose, or 1.2m from a fixed water outlet on the wall if the shower has a flexible hose.

Take yourself to the nearest reference library. Ask to see a copy of BS7671. Ensure the copy is new enough to cover Amendment No 3 of 2000.
Alternatively purchase/borrow one of the excellent guides on the subject.
--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
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DB wrote:

See if this helps:
http://www.niceic.org.uk/downloads/NL139supp.pdf
--
Cheers,

John.

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DB wrote:

There shouldn't be any grey areas here since the regs are pretty clear. If we're talking about ordinary twin-and-earth cabling then no distinction is made between surface and embedded (buried) wiring in the ordinary sense. The rules here are in Regs. 601-07-01 and 601-07-02 and amount to a statement that such cabling cannot be used to supply equipment in a higher numbered zone.
The special circumstances in which this can be ignored are when embedded cabling complies with Reg. 522-06-06 (i), (ii) or (iii) - i.e. the cable is a type which has an earthed metal covering (armour or screen, etc.) and complies with certain standards, or is of concentric construction, or is enclosed in earthed conduit etc., or is protected sufficiently to prevent penetration by nails or screws, or is buried more than 50 mm deep in the wall.
To assess your situation more fully we need to know the following:
- how far (horizontally on a plan view) is the macerator and its means of connection from the shower outlet?
- is the shower outlet fixed or demountable/movable?
- what is the IP rating of the macerator unit?
- how is it connected to the supply? - you mentioned a "junction box" but I would expect to see a fused connection unit or flex outlet plate of some kind; if there are any controls (isolator switch, etc., where do those fit in on the plan?
--
Andy

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btw - forgot to mention - the toilet roll holder is on the outside of the shower curtain - maintaing the guarantee of a wet free wipe. :)
wrote:

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Who needs toilet paper when you have fluffy cotton shower towels.
--
Clive Mitchell
http://www.bigclive.com
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