We've just had a detailed quote for some building work on our house, but not had a chance yet to discuss it with the builder.
One puzzling thing is the mention of fire doors and door closers. The builder seems to have quoted for door closers on nearly every door in the house, including doors in areas where no work or changes are required (for example, all the bedrooms).
He has also quoted for "changing doors to fire doors"; again this applies to doors that we hadn't expected to be changed into anything.
Does anyone happen to know if all these closers and fire doors are required by building regulations?
They were if you were adding a third (or more) stories. I have a recollection this changed in some way just recently, but I can't recall what the change was.
Simple answer is YES. The builder knows the current regulations on fire safety and prevention. If this is a loft conversion you are having, then the regulations are now very strict, right across the whole of the UK and Ireland.
But, one thing I will tell you to do is, make sure the barsteward does exactly what he says he is going to do on his quote. If you have an estimate, then make sure he discusses everything that he is going do to, before he gets started on it. If you see any sort of missed bits that he should have done, pull him up immediately on finding it, and get his explanation on why it is missing. You don't have to be rude in doing this. Something like, I see that you are getting to that bit now. What happens there then? Is a lot better than getting upetty and pulling him up with a stern face and tough voice.
But what he says about new fire break measures is correct. They have been for a few years now, and have saved a good many lives in those few years. So go with what he says.
Good luck with it all. And some photos' after it is finished, would be nice. :-)
It used to be fire doors on the habitable rooms in the new storey (self closing) and the door to any room opening onto the escape route to be made self closing.
This was revised IIRC to require fire doors for all doors mentioned above, but the relaxation of the self closing requirement (presumably in recognition that they almost always get taken off once building regs approval has been granted!)
"Some building work" is a bit vague. If you were to let us know what you're planning, we might be able to help you.
Builders, bless their little hearts, aren't always up to date with changes to the Building Regulations. Speak to Building Control who, I suspect, may need to be involved anyway.
This is a two-storey semi-detached house. We're having the loft extended, and turned into a bedroom, a study and a small shower room.
Downstairs, various building works will be carried out (getting a wall or two taken away, and an extension bult at the back for a utility room, for example).
I can understand that if a door is fitted to the kitchen where there was no door previously then building recommendations might mandate that a fire door be used, but that existing doors might need changing is not something I've heard of before.
What do you mean by "having the loft extended"? If the loft was not previously a habitable room, or rooms (did it have a staircase?), then it's a loft conversion, and current Building Regulations require a 30- minute fire door to the new landing, and every door on the escape corridor to the outside to be a 30-minute fire door. This means every door that opens onto the landing(s) and the hall, on your way to the front door. You no longer need automatic closers on any of these doors
- if your builder thinks you do, then he doesn't know the regs properly.
The regs changed some time in 2006. Prior to that, you needed automatic closers on all the doors mentioned above, which had to be 30- minute fire doors. There was an alternative, whereby if you had suitable escape windows in the loft, you didn't need fire doors to the escape corridor, (apart from the new one at the top landing) but you did need self-closers. That alternatrive option was removed in 2006, so see first para above.
We had a loft conversion done in our last house after the regs had changed, but as we had put the building notice in before they changed, we used the alternative option.
On the other hand, if your loft already comprises habitable rooms, and either it was built that way or it complies with the regs in force when it was done, you might not need any of the above. Having said that, I'm sure there are considerations that apply if one room opens off another (possibly your bedroom and study). Someone else may know about this.
It's a pain. However, provided he can do it without wrecking the frames (some old frames aren't suitable for modern fire doors - too thin), you could always keep the nice doors and accidentally put them back after the job has been signed off. That's after you'ev incurred the expense of fire doors in the first place, unfortunately.
I suppose it might. Never seemed to stop everyone removing the self- closers. The joiner who converted our loft had a box of them that he took from job to job, and nobody ever paid for ;-)
The regulation for fire break is there to make you stop being frightened. Happy in the knowledge that anyone sleeping in the loft is not going to be hurt in the case of an emergency. They are there to keep you safe at home, so it's better to have them in place before the fact.
Once it's all finished, and you have all that new space to play in, you'll be wondering what all the fuss was about. :-)
I built a loft conversion and muttered about all the bloody fire regulations/escape requirements etc. Shortly after it was finished my 11 year old son had a sleep over with 6 of them sleeping in the loft conversion. After I had settled them (for the nth time) and was about to retire and go to sleep (ha ha), I had a think about it and about them all asleep up there and went off to bed wishing I hadn't done the muttering but glad I had adhered to the regulations.
Not necessarily, you can get intumescent varnish with >30 mins fire rating, apply to both sides. Proof of purchase is enough for some jobs, a receipt for the job done is good for some - what your BCO would want I dont know.
I guess that might work, but as you say, you'd need to check with Building Control. Don't forget that a fire seal is also required around the door (in ours it was a brush seal in the frame).
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