John wibbled on Saturday 19 December 2009 12:43
google.
With a bit of effort, there's usually a serious special interests forum where someone knows. I've found said information out and also the engineering menu unlock code, alternative linux system management firmware (it's the sort of thing I *would* do, but I'm not, because I value the contents of my trousers).
If you start with the model number of a set that looks good, then there's a good chance you can find out more.
Not even from pins 1&3 on the SCART socket?
By "Panel" I mean a display which is not a complete TV - just the bit that does the picture, not the receiver. A bit like the one on a computer.
STB is "Set Top Box" - the decoder for Sky, or Freeview, or whatever you have over there. What would have been the tuner in a hi-fi separates system, except obviously it does picture too.
TN is a type of LCD.
You might like to ask again on uk.tech.digital-tv.
Andy
To check on "what panel do I have"...
- TN - limited viewing angle, washed out, poor colour
- IPS - wider viewing angle, crisp image, great colour
TN can only display 262k colours, they fool the eye into believing there are more colours by interstitial colours (dark green then light green alternated quickly) or other tricks. IPS can display 16.7M colours (True Colour). TN has 170 degree viewing angle defined by contrast ratio falling to as low as 10:1 or 5:1, whereas PVA & IPS are
186 degree with contrast ratio remaining far higher without "colours compressing to black". If you have a TN panel monitor, tilt it backwards and watch the colours go to black. Despite the tricks with TN, they still suffer displaying dark or night time films - they can't get sufficient grades of black so the image basically becomes invisible - IPS does better, but not as good as Plasma or CRT.Faces...
- Panasonic a bit "putty", incredible for sea images
- Sony do human faces better, not as good at motion or sea
That was true of Tau vs Trinitron, Tau gave a better picture but most people like the slightly posterish colours of Trinitron (which in LCD would be PVA re "suffering" the same sort of abstract colourish compared to truly natural).
Panasonic 26" is 349 at Amazon with 1yr warranty, check John Lewis. Sony 26" is 355 at Amazon with free 3yr warranty, check John Lewis.
Toshiba do good picture, tolerable sound. Samsung do good picture, awful sound unless you spend on the higher end 32". LG tend to do good picture and ok sound. As with all check carefully what you are getting if you need multiple HDMI and want an IPS panel (which is as good as they get).
Ignore contrast ratios and such like, you can create whatever fiction you want with a TN panel - put next to a good IPS and sit at an angle in your room, have an film with dark images (WWII) and you will soon see the shortcomings.
Before buying...
- Check with AVforums
- 1) any backlight or colour or motion or reliability issues
- 2) any suggestions re alternative
Check around to see if Panasonic or Sony have free 5yr warranty, they did last year.
There is usually 1-2 oddball bargains at any one time such as IPS panel, 1 HDMI, 26", Panasonic for very little money (=A3285 in March
2009). Consider the Sony 20" was nearly that price with TN panel and 20" is a real letterbox.On that note, if you are used to 21-25" CRT 4:3 you will want 26" LCD re widescreen to avoid "letterbox". A 26" is near enough the same height as 21" CRT Sony for example. A 32" is nice, but if you don't watch much TV the 26" size can be passable - realise 32" is very WIDE. The extra size is good if you watch a lot of films.
In message , js.b1 writes
Whilst I wouldn't disagree that IPS panels are better, I don't think that it means the OP should necessarily disregard TN panels. Just becuase one thing is better doesn't means the alternative might be bad. Esp. considering the OP was asking about cheap LCD's.
Like much else in the AV world much depends on what the end user requires and is bothered about. sometimes we can get hung up on what is the best, as opposed to what is good enough. horses, course etc.
I've just bought a 23 inch combined monitor and TV (LG M237WD - it uses a TN panel) - £200 -ish. for use in the play/family room both as a monitor on one of the computers and as a TV for freeview and DVD playback, and probably as a display for the Wii arriving in a few days time.
I'm very happy with it. no problems with the viewing angle - in the context of where and how it is used it isn't any sort of issue, and it certainly doesn't look washed out nor have poor colour
Depends very much as well on viewing distance. Our 32 inch WS Trinitron CRT still looks slightly lost in the sitting room in this house, which is much bigger than the old house where it felt about right, if not slighty on the big side
186 degree? That's a good trick. You can see it from slightly behind? (93 degrees to either side of centre line)
Andy
The viewing angle figures are entirely figments of the specifiers' imaginations and have no connection whatsoever with reality. Since nearly all TN screens claim 170 degrees (and are actually pretty crap at anything more than 45 degrees or so off centre) then the better PVA and IPS screens have to claim even sillier values in order to show they're better.
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember Andy Champ saying something like:
Proper 3D!
Or is it a solid angle? formed by adding te lateral viewing angle to teh vertical?
I do know that this sams-dung monitor here is WAY better than my acer portable, on viewing angle.
Don't buy anything if you want to be future proof. I'm not sure what's happening in Ireland but here HD DTTV will be using a new standard and, AFAIK, /no/ TVs or STBs sold here now is compatible with it.
And I'd avoid cheap sets too. There usually more trouble than they're worth IME.
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember Mark saying something like:
Yep. DVB-T2 is coming along and I suspect that RTE will launch with that. They're being really cagey about things so far, but they're in the lucky position of not being committed to any one system yet. I guess the testing that's being done using DVB-T1 MPEG4 is just a stopgap method to determine coverage, etc.
True enough in general. I'm hoping to find a decent compromise.
Avoid Cello. I thought they were John Lewis own brand and would be OK. The one we have is incredibly frustrating and obviously doesn't have enough horsepower to handle the response to remote control requests whilst decoding and displaying a picture.
MBQ
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember "js.b1" saying something like:
In the end I got a Samsung LE32B450 as a stopgap telly. It seems ok now, but my god, out of the box it was all over the place. Brightness, contrast, backlighting, colour, all sky-high as to be unwatchable. Now that it's partially sorted out, it seems not too bad and I'll have another go at finalising it tomorrow. Haven't a clue if it's an IPS panel on it or not, but viewing angles and black levels seem ok to me. I got this one largely because a small local TV shop had it in stock and I've dealt with him a few times over the years so know he's good at backing up what he sells. Plus, I'd like to see him stay in business.
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