Water valves - why multiturn?

[Psalm 75 Righteous horns]

Multi turn valves rust so you can't turn them when needed. Quarter turns will stay mobile. Why anyone uses multi turns for on-off is beyond me

[Marilyn Manson]

Just as with so many other things, be they house related, automotive, even computers, some simple preventative maintenance can forestall many problems.

Never leave a multi-turn valve fully open. Open it full and then close it

1/8 to 1/4 turn towards close. If it does freeze up, you have some wiggle room to free it up. Just like rocking a car out of the snow, a little back and forth on the valve will free it up.

Exercise your shut offs annually. Close them and then open them. You change your furnace filter, don't you? You change the oil in your vehicle, don't you? You reverse your ceiling fans, don't you? Add "exercise shut-offs" to your list of chores and you'll never have a frozen valve again. In addition, if you find that they leak or don't fully close, you can take care of it as time allows and not in the middle of an emergency.

[Ed Pawlowski]

One exception. Water to the washing machine. Shut it off after doing laundry in case the rubber hoses are ready to split.

I'm guilty of not doing that much of the time.

[Cindy Hamilton]

For a while we had automatic (clockwork) shutoff valves to the washer. After the second one died, we just put regular ball valves in their place. I confess we never shut off the water. But the hoses are armored and the washer is on the three-season porch so a leak wouldn't be a huge disaster.

[danny burstein]

Gotta ask about this one. I've seen laundry hoses with built in safety shut-offs, which supposedly detect when the water flow is too high (as would happen if it burst).

Good idea, BUT, I've also seen a horrendous number of "doesn't work" ratings.

Anyone find a system that's reliable?

Thanks

[Ralph Mowery]

I moved and was waiting to sell a house. I had left the washer at the old house and the water on. The pipe got a hole in it and leasked a lot of water. It was in a utility room outside the main house so no water damage. When my dad passed away I cut off the well pump unless I was there, all so the water heater.

Probably should have just pulled the main power switch as it was spring and did not need any heat.

[Ed Pawlowski]

Seems washers are most prone. Often tucked away in a basement or place not often visited.

In my house, toilets and DW are on braided SS hoses but the washer is on the factory supplied rubber. I do have the braided hoses for them but have not replaced them yet.

[Marilyn Manson]

I have stainless steel braid-wrapped hoses. Are they infallible? No, but...

Basement laundry, so a leak would suck, but not be disastrous.

[micky]

Do they mention this in the owners manual for washing machines? I'm certain they say something like "Always turn the water off when not using the machine", but do they say that hoses actually and frequently do split? They should.

My machine is old so I haven't read an owners manual written less than

43 years ago.

[micky]

When mine leaked it didn't burst and I'm 95% sure it was leaking less water than the washing machine used. Instead, it was spraying water all over the basement laundry room. So I guess thos special hoses would not have stopped it.

I don't know how long it was spraying, but when I woke up in he morning, even on the second floor I could hear a noise from the water pipes. I went hunting and it was the basement.

There wasn't too much damage, but a friend** who lived in suburban DC had gotten me a set of white and yellow phone books for DC and most suburbs. They were 3 feet above the hoses and sort of hidden by the shelves, but still they were soaked. They eventually dried out but I think all the pages are stuck together. I'll admit I had not used them yet, and probably would not have. Other boxes got wet too and don't look as nice, but it wasn't as bad as the 10 other baseement water leaks I've had.

Ugh.

[Marilyn Manson]

I don't know when the manual for my washer was written, but it is a currently sold model, so I'm going to guess fairly recently. (whatever "fairly recently" means) In any case, I just bought it 2 weeks ago, so use that as a guide.

It does say: "Turn off the water supply when the washer is not being used."

We often use our washer to set things on when loading the basement fridge, or folding laundry, or washing something in the utility sink, so it's almost always "being used". Therefore we never turn off the water supply. ;-)

As far as replacing the hoses, the only thing I could find was this, in the Installation section:

"CAUTION Make sure to use new hoses..."

I did not and the washer still works.

[Scott Lurndal]

The hoses are not (and were never) designed for water heaters. It's not surprising at all that they failed.

[Marilyn Manson]

SS braided hose are typically advertised as "burst proof" not "leak proof".

They are often considered the "minimum safety precaution" when considering what hoses to use.

Although I don't know your exact situation, I am assuming (I know, dangerous) that when you say "spring leaks" you don't mean that they burst. Bursting is bad, leaking has all sorts of levels.

I've had copper pipes "spring leaks", but they were minor and no damage to deal with. Had the pipes "burst", the result would have been very different.

What do you use on your washing machine?

BTW...my new *dryer* has a water connection for the steam feature. The appliance store offered to sell us the "steam kit" for $20, but we passed.

When the guy came to install the washer/dryer he said that he didn't see a steam kit on the order. I told him that I didn't order one. He said "I've got like

50 of them on the truck. I'll put one on for you anyway."

I saved $10, he made $10. Win-Win

[Marilyn Manson]

"The hoses"? What do you mean by "the hoses"? Do you know what hoses Bob used?

These SS braided hoses *are* designed for water heaters. Designed and approved.

Approvals and Listings:

ASME A112.18.6 CSA B125.6 NSF/ANSI/CAN 61 NSF/ANSI 372

[invalid unparseable]

I have actually had two shut off valves spring leaks. One was just a drip but the other a stream.

[Marilyn Manson]

I went into a storage area in my basement and felt a "mist" on my face. I tracked it down to pinhole where a 1/2" pipe entered a T-fitting. No dripping, just a light spray.

The 2' long pipe entering the bottom of the T-fitting had been bent into a sweeping curve and when I cut it at the fitting, it sprang back, leaving a 2" gap between the cut and the fitting. That connection had been under a lot of "pull-out" force for 40+ years. The only thing holding it in that position was the solder. I've always wondered how that connection was sweated together. Whoever did it may have had a helper holding the pipes together.

I removed the curved section of pipe and ran pieces of straight pipe, having to use two

22 1/2° fittings, about 3" part to replicate the curve and enter the T at the proper angle. When I was done, there were no "extra forces" at the connection.

[micky]

Sounds like a good place to go in hot weather.

Ooops. This is bad for me. When i brought my water heater home, they had rested something on top of the box and crushed the top of the heater some. I don't like to throw things away som I connected the pipes anyhow, with a little pushing. Copper pipes, solder connection. It's been at least 5 years so it may start misting any minute.

That sounds good. I wish I was going to redo mine before it starts leaking.

[Marilyn Manson]

Sharkbites and Pex. You could probably fix it in less than a 1/2 hour, shopping not included.

[Jim Joyce]

Do you happen to have a floor drain in the area near the washer?

Two houses ago, I had such a floor drain, but my last house and my current house do not. Still, I've never worried about shutting off the water to the washer when it's not in use.

[micky]

Almost exactly what I said, except mine was stronger. I included the word "always".

It's not enough. It's the minimum that the lawyers said would keep them from being sued succesffully when a hose leaked. But they have greater knowledge of this problem and they should have made clear what can happen and that it offen happens when water is left on.

They could even suggest those mechanical valves that turn them both off at the same time. if it weren't a lot of work, I'd put one in myself.

Yep, you showed that there warning is of no help.

And how long do they stay new. Mine lasted about 20 or 25 years. After one sprayed (not a mist, more than that.) I got SS but one started dripping a bit at one end, but only when it was twisted the right/wrong way. When I finally replaced the belt on the machine I put in two new ones and, I hope, I marked which one of the old ones never dripped.

In the process, I found that the handle on one of the washer faucets was plastic and cracked. Then I went out of town for 4 monmths nad when I got back and found the handle on my desk, it took 3 days to figure out what it came from.

It has 8 splnes and all the ones currently sold have 11 or 16. Maybe I can find a house being torn down and I can get a handle there. Would one of those stores that recycles parts from old houses being torn down have something this small.

The store in baltimore

Like these but mine is plastic and has 8 splines.

Amazing.