Using the old "White" 12-2 Romex (2024 Update)

[clare]

Available since 1987, required since 1991 IIRC

[gfretwell]

Article 336.26 (NM cable construction specifications/conductors) in the 1987 code says "Conductors shall be rated at 90c."

[fred.flintstone]

Agreed, but there are places where this is not the case. For example, if you can still get a 200 or 300W incandescent bulb, you can still screw it into a fixture rated at 60W max. Using a 100W is likely within the safety margin, but not a 200W or larger. And now they have those halogen bulbs which run hotter..... That could be a fire hazzard even if a 60W was used.

I bet they still do, just not as much, due to breakers. A local auto service center still has an old fuse box with plug fuses. They never close the cover on this panel, and I noticed that all the fuses are green (30A). If I was into betting, I'd bet that they are all feeding #14 or #12 wire. I know that if I said anything about it, I'd be told that it's been that way for the past 50 years and has not caused a problem.

Back when I was a maintenance man for a rental company, who owned about

70 homes, I often had to repair electrical problems. I always replaced all the 30A fuses with the correct size. A year later, I'd come back to that property and find all 30A fuses again. For awhile I began to install the fusestat adaptors and fusestats. That solved the problem in most cases, but then these places were having constant calls for power outages, because the renters did not understand how to replace the fusestat, and this was costing the owners of the rental company money, which they did not want to spend. I tried to convince them to add circuits to things like an air conditioner and kitchen appliances, and did so in some of the worst of the houses, but the rental company didn't want to spend the money. They had the same attitude..... "The 30A fuses worked fine, just put them back".

[fred.flintstone]

While there is no date on the wiring that I have, I know it's newer than

1987. It was probably made in the 90's. Just before they made it yellow.

[gfretwell]

Does it say Type NM-b? ("b" being the important distinction) NM-b was released in 1984 and quickly replaced the old NM from most manufacturers It was hard to find any NM that wasn't NM-b in the mid 80s.

[Nate Nagel]

If it matters to the OP, "NM-B" is 90C rated, "NM" is 60C rated. The change to NM-B happened before the change to the standardized color coding for the jackets.

nate

[samandinezmoore]

I am looking to put a four foot baseboard heater in a bedroom . In the past I could use a 12-2 with a ground. Is that still up to code using 220 power and if it is what breaker should I use?

[gfretwell]

If the heater is OK on a 20a circuit (1920w or less) 12-2 is fine. Reidentify the white wire to black (or some other color besides green). The white vs yellow vs orange jacket thing is more a marketing gimmick than a code requirement but it does make it easier for inspectors to figure out what wire size it is without looking at the jacket . on a heater 240.4(D) rules, 20a breaker on a 12 ga wire.

[Mayayana]

12 guage - 20 amp 14 guage - 15 amp But 220 watts? I think you'll find there are two hot connectors, to be used with 12-3.

[gfretwell]

If this is just a line to line load (220v AKA 240v) why would you need to bring a neutral to it? (12-3)

[jamesgang]

st I could use a 12-2 with a ground. Is that still up to code using 220 po wer and if it is what breaker should I use?

Depends on the amperage of the baseboard heater and the distance from the b reaker panel. In all probability a four foot baseboard section will work o k on 12/2 with a ganged 20 amp breaker. But you should still check the hea ter's power requirements on the box.

[Mayayana]

| If this is just a line to line load (220v AKA 240v) why would you need | to bring a neutral to it? (12-3)

I don't think I've ever hooked up baseboard heat. I'm just assuming US, 220 volts is going to need two hot wires and one white. Maybe I'm wrong.

[gfretwell]

If there is no 120v load, you do not need the white wire. You can reidentify it some other color (tape, paint etc) and use it as a hot.

200.7(C)(1) If part of a cable assembly and where the insulation is permanently reidentified to indicate its use as an ungrounded conductor, by painting or other effective means at its termination, and at each location where the conductor is visible and accessible. Identification shall encircle the insulation and shall be a color other than white, gray, or green.

[tstrelka]

Type NM-B cable first began to be manufactured with color-coded jackets in

2001 to aid in identification of the conductor size. The color code that wa s introduced, which continues to be used today is as follows: 14 AWG - White 12 AWG - Yellow 10 AWG - Orange 8 AWG - Black 6 AWG - Black

This color coding system was developed to aid those who sell, install, and inspect Type NM-B cable so that the cable size can easily be identified, to reduce mistakes resulting from the use of an incorrect conductor size.

It should be noted that this color coding system is not a requirement of NF PA 70, National Electrical Code(R) (NEC(R)) or UL 719, Safety Standard for Nonmetallic-Sheathed Cable. Type NM-B can be produced and sold without usin g this color code. As such, the print legend, which is required by the NEC( R), should be used to verify the conductor size.

[Steve C]

Donald Trump?

[csnyder]

In some places blue sheath was used on AFCI protected circuits, orange was for electric heat, red was used for fire and smoke alarm wiring, black and white were for regular circuits - black 15 amp and white 20 amp. This goes back a couple decades . Can't remember what yellow was - - -

[Greg H]

Electric toilets?