type of chimney to install?

[Ari]

I have a medium sized home in Maine. It was built by the previous owner, who wasn't an architect by any means>>: The existing single flue block chimney goes up through the living room and blocks the second floor hallway-it has to be relocated-it doesn't fit the house. My wife and I can only assume the previous owner built the house first, then added the chimney....rather than designing the chimney into the house during it's design.

The house is not large, so a fireplace is not an option. So, we need a single flue chimney for the System 2000 oil heating system.

The only appropriate location is on the outside of the house, there is no way to incorporate a new chimney into the existing house.

Due to the placement of the first and second story windows, the chimney location is very limited. Unfortunately, the (underground) exit of the sewer line from the house precludes the installation of a concrete pad required for a conventional block or brick chimney. So, were thinking about a metalbestos chimney because it doesn't require a concrete pad. The new chimney also has to be inexpensive-excavation, concrete pad and insulating the surrounding ground with buried styrofoam to prevent the frost from getting underneath the chimney base.

Metalbestos is not cheap, but can be installed by carpenters and DIY'ers. So, it has it's advantages.

Any suggestions or comments?

Thanks.

A

[Speedy Jim]

Thinking outside the box: How about *no* chimney?

I don't have any experience with System 2000, but came across this: "System 2000's modern boiler design and combustion chamber insure thorough, clean combustion. System 2000 burns so cleanly, it can offer a through-the-wall venting option compatible with either a natural gas or heating oil, even if no chimney is available."

I take that to mean the mfr offers an induced draft version that can sidewall-vent without chimney.

Figure out what your proposed chimney might cost and see what a System 2000 conversion would cost.

Jim

[Goedjn]

What, exactly, do you mean by "blocks the second floor hallway"? Do you mean it sticks into it and it's presence offends you, (in which case how do you get to the rooms on the other side of it?) or do you mean it actually obstructs traffic? If you've got at least a 32" passage, I'd leave it alone.

[marson]

a metalbestos chimney is a good way to go. my concern in your case is that if you burn wood and the chimney is outside of the house, it will tend to collect creosote and possibly have draft issues. if you have to run it outside of the house, i think you might want to build an insulated box around it (with required clearances of course). it also needs to be 2' above any point on the roof within 10 feet measured on the horizontal. when you buy a metalbestos chimney, they come with detailed instructions.

[m Ransley]

Some furnaces-boilers can`t use chimneys they are so efficient a chimney would only condensate water as they don`t warm up, they are called Direct Vent, The system 2000 may be a Direct Vent unit, or look into direct vent and junk the chimney.

[Ari]

No, it's exactly like I stated in the message. The guy who built the house put in a 38 inch wide hallway. But, 18 inches of that width are consumed by chimney. It's not a matter of aesthetics or a minor intrusion into the hallway, it blocks half of the width of the hallway and you have to walk around it to get to the bedrooms on the other side of the chimney! This is not and exaggeration, the guy who built the house wasn't too brite::>

He also never sealed the blocks, you can imagine what he side of the chimney looks like!!!

He used 1 inch of mortar between each tier, which is much to much mortar, so the mortar is cracked. He had multiple chimney fires because he burned pine and spruce slabs from his sawmill-so, the liner is shot from end to end.

The lower blocks have cracks running vertically in addition to the cracks in the mortar.

It's shot, it's gotta go.

Regards,

A

[Ari]

Interesting Jim,

Direct venting is generally not accepted around here. The climate is cold, and in the winter, the system runs a lot! We also get our hot water from the boiler, so it runs even more. Oil smoke tends to smell bad due to the sulphur content of the oil. Not sure I'd want a direct vent heating system.

Worst of all, the system runs in the summer to make hot water, when windows tend to be open much more.

I haven't asked the oil burner people about it and I don't know if our system supports direct venting or not. But, I'll look into it. Thanks for the suggestion.

A

[Goedjn]

Ok, in that case, you're suck with replacing it with something. A zero-clearance metal chimney up the outside of the house will work fine.

[George E. Cawthon]

I had a metalbestos chiminey for a wood stove I installed. Not sure what the weight would be for two stories but would probably total less than

100-150 pounds. I don't understand your concern for a pad, in fact, I don' know why you would want a pad. The chimney could be supported by a frame bolted to outside wall studs. That would provide ground clearance (for flowers and that kind of stuff). I assume you are going to build a chase around the pipe rather than have the pipe in the open.

Also, you might not need the insulated type of chimney if your furnace supports direct venting. In that case, a single wall pipe might be just fine; plastic pipe might even be ok for moving the fumes to the top of the house.

[hallerb]

Chimney is a hazard, remove it completely, gain back hall.

Replace or retrofit furnace to a direct vent type.

This will get you a high efficency furnace, your hall back, increase your resale value since as is ots terrible.

Have you checked on vent systems for your existing furnace>

How is your water heated? Do you need chiney for that?

[Ari]

No, I don't want a pad at all. I only mentioned the pad because no reputable chimney installer will put a brick or block chimney up unless it has a proper pad. To let frost get under a pad would be a disaster in these parts.

The concrete pad was only mentioned as a requirement for a block/brick chimney-not a metalbestos type.

No, it would be in the open.

The System 2000 does not support direct venting without additional hardware (I have an older model (EK-1). I think the newer models support direct veinting without additional hardware.

Thanks,

A

[tmurf.1]

Why didn't you hire a home inspector before you bought this house.

[Ari]

We did have it inspected and appraised. Inspector pointed out all the serious problems, appraiser appraised it at $60K, but told us it would have been a $120K house with repairs. Throughout the years, we have done repairs, primarily to fix the biggest flaws....the chimney is one of the last remaining flaws that is functional and aesthetic. So, repairing it will be a big plus when it comes to resale.

We paid $51K, so we bought it at the right price.

To answer your question in a nutshell, we bought it knowing hte flaws and the approximate price to repair them.

A

[Ari]

Yes, we know it's a hazard, although we do have CO2 detectors on every floor near the chimney.

Yes, resale value is everything (after functionality and safety)....we are well aware of the advantages of taking out the defects. It's a no brainer::>

Am looking into it now.

We have a System 2000 and the hot water comes from the heating system too. Since the house isn't large, we have no need for a dual flue chimney, which is why I asked about the metalbestos chimney.

Regards,

A

[hallerb]

Either convert your existing furnace to direct vent or replace the furnace with a high efficency one and remove the chimney altogether.

the new furnace would be a selling point, and the chimney has only negative value

a freestanding chimey would not add to the appearance of your home for resale value, and most likely detract from it

[George E. Cawthon]

Ah..., that explains it. You may still want to rethink leaving it open. check to make sure that the chimney can withstand weather. I don't think the joints in mine would be adequate, but that may be just a model variation.