Tile industry pricing question

[mauigeek]

We recently had tile laid throughout our house & I think the tile company is trying to rip us off.

We paid for 25% extra tile for breakage, which is standard (actually a little high).

Now that the tile is installed, they're telling us it's the "industry standard" to pay for installation of the breakage.

So, for instance, on a 100sqft room ...they're wanting us to pay for

125sqft of installation. Keep in mind, this is for *installation*, not the actual price of the tile.

That seems crazy to me to pay for 25 feet of installation that didnt happen.

I've called a few other tile places & they said this is NOT industry standard. They say if you have a 100sqft room, you pay for 125sqft of tile & 100sqft of installation.

Anyone have any experience with this?

[G Henslee]

That's bullshit but if that's what *that* company does and their customers agree to it and accept the contract on that basis then that's the way it is. So, did you accept those terms?

First time in 30+ years of construction incl. extensive tile/marble that I've heard that one.

Yup. That's the norm.

[mauigeek]

Thanks for letting me know I'm not crazy. Anyone else?

[G Henslee]

You didn't answer my question hot shot...

[mauigeek]

oh. well, im not really sure. I'm still trying to dig up the original estimate. It was more of an estimate, not an actual contract. Nothing was signed.

[G Henslee]

Well, verbal agreement carrys weight also in court. But how much $$ we talkin' here? You already have the work done? No contract?

[mauigeek]

Ya, the work's done. It's Hawaii, so things are done a little less formal. It's about 1200 sqft altogether. ...plus there's still the outside work to do, but we've already decided to go with another company on that, because this is not the only problem we've had with them.

Basically, we had some other problems with them, which they agreed to "eat", but in return, they ate that cost, then they charged us for a shower pan that they didnt charge us for ...we said fine. Then they came back with the invoice for the shower pan at $1800! That works out to $89/sqft. The other shower pan in the house worked out to $35/sqft

[mauigeek]

i found the original estimate.

it doesnt specify either way if the price is per actual sqft or if it includes breakage.

....it just says "main room approx 715sqft". At that point they had only seen plans, they hadnt actually come out & measured.... but the actual sqft of the main room is closer to 600sqft.

[RicodJour]

These are what we call "learning experiences". The time to iron out the details was before the project got started. Everything must be in writing. Omitting these things will only hurt one person - you. Saying that things are less formal in Hawaii is not an excuse nor a justification for cutting corners.

As to your original question, no, of course not. Extra tile is bought as insurance against running short due to miscuts, accidents, rejected tile, etc. Running short on a tile job can be disasterous. It's a materials-only expense. They're looking to make up some of that money they feel they lost. Since you don't have anything concrete to work with, what are you going to do? Sue them? That should work. For the lawyers. Small claims? Prepare to waste gobs of your time.

I wouldn't roll over, but you've dug yourself a pit. Maybe a written contract is required and just commonly ignored. I know that home improvement contracting requires a license in Hawaii. Contact the State License Board [phone] and find out what is required of the contractor. You're looking for leverage and that's the place to start.

You've gone about this wrong and this is really a poor way to handle these negotiations, but you're in damage control territory and won't be using this contractor again.

Learn from this. Do your homework before you go to school.

R

[Kyle Boatright]

Pay for what you agreed to on the estimate or in your verbal agreements. If these guys didn't mention the 25% extra labor charge until after the fact, there is no way you should pay it.

[George E. Cawthon]

No experience, but that has got to be B.S. Did you sign a contract? Then go by the contract. If not, tell them to lay the broken tile on the patio concrete slab and you will pay for the extra 25 percent installation. That ought to get there attention. Actually it won't because they obviously don't mind being sleazy. If it's in the contract and they really press you for it, tell you plan an add campaign (e-mail) and newspaper to let everyone know what they are doing.

[dadiOH]

I do my own tile. When I buy tile I figure I am entitled to a box of unbroken tile...IOW, I return broken tiles.

-- dadiOH ____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06... ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that. Get it at

[siralfred]

It's not tiles that are delivered broken, but broken while cutting on site. A good tile installer will come and measure, make a complete layout and know exactly how many full size tiles he needs to complete the job. Then add 10% for accidental breakage and minor miscalculations.

[G Henslee]

At those prices I'm real tempted to come over with a helper and do your work. ;-)