Post Pulling away from Deck. Pics.

[utilitarian]

Hi,

I attached some photos. Looking for some advice on how to deal with this. I'm thinking of nailing in an L bracket or two into the right angle of the post and the diagonal 2 x 4 you can see in the pics. Also maybe nail a straight metal strap horizontally across the post, the 2 boards, and the rafter.

One of the supporting posts is leaning away from the deck, and a gap is opening up. I already have nailed in the sheet metal connectors underneath, can't think of their correct name, to hold the outer end of the deck to the rafters, so it will not ( I hope) lean out any more.

The post seems to be warped somewhat, since by using a level I found that it is leaning away from the house near the ground, but up on top, it is actually leaning towards the house just a bit.

The deck is 23 years old. Don't want to pay for a brand new deck yet.

Could it be that the rafter is warping or shrinking also, and pulling back from the post ?

By the way, there is no railing on the side of the deck because there was a privacy fence there, which recently blew off completely.

Any input appreciated. Thanks.

[JIMMIE]

Steel plate

Jimmie

[DerbyDad03]

It's hard to tell from the photos exactly what is warped/twisted.

2 of the photos seem to show that the interior rim joist is twisted, but it may just be because the post is pulling it out.

You might try adding a temporary post under that corner to take some weight of the post and then use a come-along to try and wrench the post and rim joist back into place.

As I said, it's hard to tell exactly what's twisted, and forcing the rim joist back into place may simply transfer the stresses to some other location along the structure.

I certainly don't think you need a new deck, but it make make sense to replace the rim joists and posts if they are twisted so far out of shape that you can't get them back to where they belong without causing other problems.

[Stubby]

UGH! Whoever built that, has absolutely no support/beams or otherwise, holding up the deck. The only thing holding the deck up, is the nails/screws from the outside rim board into the joist band. What a horrible design, I'm surprised it passed inspection, if there were one.

Just off hand, b/4 working under that one, I would want additional temporary support. Reason being, is to keep from getting killed.

I would imagine you could carriage bolt a double beam affixed to the posts (I could go into detail, how to make this a simpler solution than what it may sound). You would have to modify your diagonal bracing to accept the double 2x8 beam.

Since the front rim board is this poorly attached, I would also be concerned about the rim board affixed to the structure. Also a concern would be if the structure rim is properly flashed/sealed.

Good luck.

[hrhofmann]

Several very large L-shaped brackets strategically plced ought to hold it up for a few more years. The biggest problem is no solid connection between the post and the side beam, those nails don't look half big enough in diameter or length.

[jamesgangnc]

some advice on

I'm not fond of that engineering either. You need to push that post back towards the house. Then I'd put a carrage bolt through the center and both those 2x10's or whatever they are. As well as a steel plate across the side with lag bolts into the post and carrage bolts into that outside 2x10..

Not sure how to move the post though. A comealong if you can find something to attach the other end to. Or maybe a truck bumper :-)

[dpb]

utilitarian wrote: ...

...

You need a whole lot more beef than that...

As a couple of others already said you need some serious support _after_ you get the thing moved back into place.

Also, you need to

a) not let anybody or anything on it until it is repaired, and b) get some solid bracing underneath to ensure it doesn't come down while you're trying to work on it.

That side joist needs to have the nails cut off so it can be moved back into alignment vertically. Then, the outer rim needs brought back in to where it was. At that point, a plate as somebody else suggested or an outer joist can be added and fastened thru the post or lagged w/ minimum

3/8" fasteners.

For aesthetics, rather than running another joist underneath as somebody said for the support I'd probably get another 6x and make a ledger of it endways about 18" long or so bolted thru the post to let the deck set on. That should then be securely tied to the rim and thru-bolted w/ steel plate.

Agree w/ the assessment of the likely weakness of construction at the house end as well. I'd surely assess that.

If you're not confident you can tell what's adequate and what's not, I'd suggest getting a structural opinion.

As is, this is a serious accident about to happen...

--

[keith]

some advice on

Larger nails wouldn't have helped. Nails into end grain won't resist the forces pulling this thing apart.

[Tony Hwang]

How in world it passed the code when built. Foundation of posts are in question. As far as I am concerned, this is a safety issue. I would not step onto that deck.

[Don Phillipson]

Joist hangers (nowadays required by building codes) will not correct the warping but will help stabilize what is there now.

[RonB]

I hate to repeat gloom and doom but stay off of it. A deck came off of a house a few miles from here about two years ago. It killed a couple of folks and injured others. In addition to the post, it looks like one corner might be pulling from the house.

That said, I suspect you might want to think about taking it down. If not, brace it up and start planning to put a properly designed beam UNDER the joists not attached to the end of the deck. Don't screw around with this this. The people who were killed in the local accident were under the deck.

RonB

[Stubby]

Joist hangers won't do a bit of good with what the OP has going on. The outside joist rim board, is "nailed/screwed" to a ledger, which the posts are notched to accept. The only thing holding that deck up, is the "nails/screws" fastened through the "post ledger" to the outside joist/rim board. The proof is, the deck _ALREADY_ has joist hangers, front & rear. Look for yourself.

The deck is a disaster, waiting to happen.

[dpb]

dpb wrote: ...

...

Thinking some more, I think I'd stick w/ the idea but notch it to fit the existing joists and extend below a ways. Can cut the bottom at

45-degree angle for the aesthetics was talking about.

That done, you've got it to bolt thru from both directions to tie corners together as well as the solid rest for the outer joist to be supported on.

Same thing could be done structurally w/ a 4" or greater angle vertically on the inner corner; just easier working w/ the wood for average homeowner-type.

Again, one would guess that there's nothing holding the inner corners together, either other than either toenailed or facenailed as that end shows it is so need similar fixup there as well...

Also, can't re-emphasize to much the need for shoring this puppy up in a hurry and securely before even thinking about working under it. There have been accidents around here as well from such death traps so it ain't no joke...

If you can't get to that immediately, at least rope it off so nobody can wander around under it, especially any of your or the neighbors' kids.

--

[Joe]

[Tony Hwang]

Hi, If they were building a deck like that w/o beam which is supported by properly footed post down to frost line with concrete, I'd put a stop to it. I just don't understand how could they get away with it? Do they build like that down South across border? I hope not.

[aemeijers]

(Sorry, accidentally sent directly to OP instead of posting.)

If the deck surface and joists themselves are sound, you can salvage most of the deck. A post at each corner, maybe a foot in, and a couple of properly sized beams UNDER the joists to catch the weight. You can then lose the current posts and front structure. Reuse any straight pieces of timber from current post structure to pretty up or add diagonal braces or whatever. Tie the whole mess together with the appropriate bits of metal from Simpson, or similar, so it doesn't move around or get picked up by wind gusts.

I'm old-fashioned- a joist that long should be held by more than end-nails and a joist hanger. Everyone else talked about the posts- I'd be just as worried about all that weight barely tied to the ledger board on house. A second floor deck, ledger board should mainly be to tie deck to house, so it doesn't feel like a boat at a dock when you step onto it. It should also have standoffs or at least proper flashing, so it does not keep the siding and wall wet behind it. Any stains on interior behind where ledger board is?

Don't hold any parties on the deck till you get a competent carpenter (at least) to look at it. Take a lot of photos and measurements, and the deck guy at the Borg DIY project desk can probably run it through the computer program they use to spec out bundles of deck materials.

I just took a closer look at pictures- the exposed joists and deck board ends look pretty sad. Before I spent any money, I'd do the icepick test on the boards, anywhere I could reach. If they are mushy, I vote with the tear it down and start over people.

Don't feel bad- my deck is also in sad shape, but it is only 30 inches off the grass, so it won't kill anyone.

[Evan]

I agree...

That deck was built so poorly that the entire section of railing on one side "blew down"... If the railing blew off and is supposed to be able to take weight when someone leans on it I shudder to think how under-sized the fasteners are holding it together...

Nails are not meant to hold major structural members together, that is what plates, angle iron and carriage bolts or lag screws are for... Nails and decking screws are not designed or intended to hold the main support beams and joists together all alone... That is why joist hangers exist to provide nailing from two planes... But nails or screws alone on the structure won't hold... That is what looks like is happening here -- one post looks to be settling and it is torquing the main support away from the deck because there aren't any true fasteners holding it together...

Tear down this deck and build a properly structured one which isn't ready to fly apart...

~~ Evan

[mm]

Should those nails into the end of the side beam have been put in at opposing angles, so it would have been much harder for them to come out????

Someone showed me to do that once, and I often do, and it works well, but I don't know all the places it's a good idea.

Another more of a guess: Should the inside joist rim board have been nailed on first? and then the second one, the outside joist rim board, nailed to it in more places than just the side beam?

[mm]

To the others here, the nails that are showing, going into the end of the side rail, ...Should they have been put in at different, opposite angles, so it would have been harder for them to come out????

Some>Hi, I attached some photos. Looking for some advice on

Off hand, I don't understand the purpose of that one idea. I think the diagonal is only there to keep the deck square.

In picture 3, it looks like the deck has gone down relative to the post. Is your deck still level?

If not, buy or rent a jack -- I forget what they're called but they have a big removeable handle, or the use a steel rod as a handle, that will screw them longer and lift up, or at least hold up your deck, while you do remove that post, lift up the deck, and reattach the post or a new non-warped one.

You can also add a thrid post permanently, between the two there now. Would that be in the way?

And/or, you could put a post on the side you are showing, half or a third of the way back from front corner. But make sure it's long enough to lift the deck up to horizontal if the deck is sloped. And allow for the post sinking further into the ground (I don't know how one does that. (My deck that is 30 inches high had some posts resting on cinderblocks. I don't think that's right but that's how it came, and since no one walks under a 30" deck, at least they're not in the way. And I can fall only 30 inches at most.)

I don't have much experience but screws seem a lot better than nails. When the force is right, the nails will just pull out, a little bit at a time but you won't be able to stop it. Maybe nails that are put in pointing towards the gap in the wood will be more resistant to that.

The one with 40 or 60 sharp bent tabs? That's not enough for this, but wasn't a bad idea for a little temporary help.

Again very little experience, but I thought wood didn't shrink linearly. Measure it and see if it a standard length. Many things are build with full 8- or 10 or whatever foot long 2x8's or whatever, whatever the standard lengths actually are.

Compare it with the other side which I gather is not having this problem.

[Stormin Mormon]

Also needs a couple posts along the wall of the house. Not much holding the deck, at the house side.