On Thu, 24 Nov 2011 18:52:44 -0500, "Robert Green"
And PERHAPS knowing she was talking to the gas company they figured
they'd get the job of replacing the boiler with another oil-fired one
if it was going to cost an extra $1100 to switch to gas- - - - - .
I don't believe they knew she was thinking of switching but it does sound
like they were trying to "get their foot in the door" for any heating
remodelling. A heating oil company's version of an "anchor baby."
No matter what their motives, they clearly did things in the wrong order.
Inspect BEFORE you pump in a full tank, not afterwards. I wonder if the
"other company" they had to call to pull the oil out wasn't a wholly-owned
subsidiary. I would have been fuming if I had been charged not only for
the oil, but its removal because I am sure I could have found someone to
pump it out for free and perhaps for a little added cash.
I can't believe they just "dumped" the oil they retrieved from her, either.
I am sure they tried not only billing her $1142 for the fill and removal,
but sold what they pulled from her tank to some other customer without
telling them it was used oil. Who would know? What a deal. Making over
$1500 on one tank.
On Fri, 25 Nov 2011 05:59:53 -0800 (PST), " firstname.lastname@example.org"
I heartilly dissagree.
They've been servicing that furnace and told her last year it was on
it's last legs. She called for an inspection. She did NOT have an
auto-fill contract and did not ask for a fill. If it was two different
companies, the oil company would not have known the service company
was checking out a "bad" furnace - but it was one company. Most
likely one receptionist, and one dispatcher.
On Nov 25, 4:21 pm, email@example.com wrote:
Agreed that she did not have an auto-fill contract. But in the
case it was disputed whether or not she asked for it to be filled.
The company says she did, she claims she did not.
She was told her furnace probably had one or two years life left
earlier that year. She got a quote from another company to
convert to gas as a result. So then in Oct, start of the heating
season, she calls for routine service. Sure sounds possible
to me that having decided she wasn't going to install the new
gas system, she decided to go with the old one for another
season. So, she called for routine cleaning/service and
certainly might have also asked for the tank to be filled.
You expect the receptionist and dispatcher to know that it was a "bad"
furnace? She was NOT calling for service on a furnace that was not
working. She called for routine service.
On Fri, 25 Nov 2011 00:49:18 -0500, "Robert Green"
While it's always conceivalbe that a customer puts crap in the oil,
the odds of it are really low, and at the least they could sell the
oil at a bargain pirce to the owner or someone in his family who has
an oil furnace. Or to an employee. After all, in the slim chance it
hurts that furnace, they can have their own company fix the furnace,
and it would be a true business expense.
That's possible too. They coul deliver it to someone they knew would
call them if he had furnace problems, maybe someone with an old
furnace, so he wouldn't blame the oil but his furnace.
. What a deal. Making over
On Sat, 26 Nov 2011 06:18:00 -0800 (PST), " firstname.lastname@example.org"
We have a company come to take our waste oil. It has to be handles by
a licensed company by state law and you need DEP permits, etc. They
charge us 10¢ a gallon for our old hydraulic oil. They pump it into
the single tank on the truck. It mixes with used motor oil,
contaminated oil, and anything else they suck up during the day.
I'm not sure what they do with it, but I know of one outfit that
filters it and burns it for heating a kiln in cement making plant.
I can see how she won, because the oil company could not show
that she had called for oil. However, I think it's likely she did
Let's look at the facts:
She is told in May that her old boiler may only last another year or
She gets a quote from another company to install a new gas
She calls in Oct for routine service on the old oil boiler.
Given that sequence, it seems likely to me that she had seen
the price of a new gas system and decided against it. Otherwise
she would not have called for service on the old one. And
having decided to continue with the existing one, it's not
unreasonable to think that she could have asked for the oil
to be filled at the same time. Or that they asked during that
call if she needed it filled and she said yes, not thinking that
it could be filled and then the boiler is found to be shot so
soon after being last inspected in May.
But since the oil company can't produce a witness who
remembers what happened, they lose.
Of course they could have sold it to a neighbor, just shut off the
valve on the tank, remove the pipe, attach a short piece of pipe, and
move 5 gallons at a time in 5gal gas cans. It's a pain in the ass,
but I'd do that before paying $538 for removal. Sell it to the
neighbor for $350 or $400, help transport it and be done with it.
But if it was filled without authorization, I'd consider that a
gift.... A good judge should do the same.....
It was both filled AND removed without authorization and then a lien put
against the house for $1142 for pumping in, pumping out AND the cost of the
oil. The judge made the oil company eat the entire fee.
On Thu, 24 Nov 2011 18:57:19 -0500, "Robert Green"
As they should have. Automatic fill usually required a contract and
often monthly budget payments. I did that for a number of years with
my old oil company until they screwed me.
I had a contract for 850 gallons at a fixed price that was in effect
until May 15. During the winter, they delivered about 750 gallons,
leaving another hundred come May. The bastards filled my tank on May
16 and charged full price, not the contracted price for the 100
gallons left on the contract that expired the day before.
It was legal, but I think unethical. After two phone calls and a
letter, they settled for the contracted price on the 100 gallons. It
was the last oil they ever sold me.
I've since installed a new, more efficient boiler and use about 450
gallons a year now.
Gawd. Are they really heating oil companies or professional "butt fu&ers?"
Maybe it's that constant sticking of hoses in holes that turns them to the
Dark Side. They're always out to stick it to someone.
Vendors don't seem to understand that by squeezing a customer they risk
losing them for life - and losing referrals, too. There are a number of
companies I'll never deal with again like Citibank. Fool me once, shame on
you, as the saying goes. My boss used to tell the story of how his dad, the
patriarch of a large clan of Irishmen, got screwed by a Ford dealer once for
undercoating he did not request and did not want. No one person in that
whole, huge extended family ever bought a Ford as a result for something
like 40 years afterwards.
In this case, it depended on the sequence of events. Had they not removed
the oil, I think the judge might have ruled she could keep it, but as you
say, some jurists might feel that's a harsh penalty. But perhaps not if she
had nowhere to sell it or no way to remove it. Then she could claim they
stuck her with something she could not use and that would cost a great deal
of money to remove and dispose of legally. I can't believe that oil was
just dumped. Much more likely it got sold to someone else.
What's the downside? How could the new recipient prove it was "bad oil?"
There are a lot of suppositions outside of the actual facts. In this case,
it seemed pretty clear the boiler was on its last legs and that inspection
should have come before filling, especially since she didn't ASK for
Obviously you've never seen what comes out of a 40 year old
tank when you pump it all out.
Clairvoyant? She CLAIMS she didn't call for filling. The oil
CLAIMS she did. Don't you think it's a bit curious that she never
they delivered oil without her calling for it before? That this one
oil gets delivered somehow without her asking for it?
Sequence of events:
Boiler is serviced in Spring and she is told it probably has 1 or 2
of life left.
She calls another company and gets a quote on a new gas system.
Oct she calls for routine service at the start of the heating season.
Company claims she also asked for the tank to be filled, she
says she did not.
Given that scenario it looks like she saw the price of a
new system, decided against it. So, getting ready for the new season
she called for routine service, ie cleaning, new nozzle, etc.
and to have the tank filled, without
thinking that it might have suddenly gone kaput.
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