One thing you have to remember: You have to change those pleated ones (at least !) every 60 days. Once they get a good "coating" on them, you are going to compromise the effectiveness of your system....
yes, it could make it cycle worse. i did not say it would fix it. his prob could very well be any number of furnace part related probs.
this was just a suggestion for a easy check he could do himself. all the heat anticipator setting is for is to match the amp draw thro the thermostat for correct furnace cycles. most run around 4 or 6 on the settings.
for some strange reason, the pointer seems to get moved occasionally. ive adjusted quite a few of them and that turned out to be the only problem. as for burning it out just by changing the setting, its not very likely. usually the only thing that will burn it out is a low voltage short from the furnace controls or a high voltage related surge thro the thermostat wire.
at any rate, the best thing to do is to call a reputable serv comp and let a tech take a look at it.
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Scootz
Thanks Scootz, waiting for the heating contractor to call me back. Probably won't here from him till Monday though.
Stone
Take the pleated filter out and replace with the kind you used to have and see if the problem goes away.
Steve B.
apples and oranges dood. he asked for a few things he might be able to check, simply. you know as well as i do that the average homeowner isnt going to have an amp probe or the knowledge to use it. it was something he could check without damaging anything or hurting himself.
yes, it should match the amp draw. do you test the amp draw on every thermostat that you lay your hands on every day? not likely. nor was it checked when the stat was installed either. most are not. usually the tech who puts it on sets it "around" 6 for carrier or 4 for older ruud or rheem equipment, as a loose general example.
no, they dont "move" themselves. maybe he pulled the cover off and wiped the dust off of it. they do get moved sometimes. it was a suggestion only. nitpick it some more, i can tell now you can't seem to let this go.
maybe so, but i didnt tell him to turn it all the way down now did i?
at least we agree on something
you know, this is why ive never posted in here, nor do i post in althvac.
he asked a simple question and got a simple answer.
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Scootz
If the system is cycling on high limit it is possibly an airflow problem. If the HO were to remove the filter and it works normally, the problem may not be solved but it would be identified, no?
Joseph
What kind of filter do you have? The home centers are selling lots of pleated filters like the 3M Filtrete. These filters have more pressure drop and resistance to air flow than a fiberglass filter dirty enough to grow seedlings in it. you could have a problem with low airflow tripping the high limit switch. Put in a clean fiberglass filter and try again. Messing with the heat anticipator is for professionals that can measure the results. Make sure the registers in all rooms are open. People sometiumes close them "to save money" and reduce airflow in the system. Low airflow can ruin equipment.
stretch
I just reread the OP's posts and it seems clear to me that it is up and burning and the fan is running when it kicks out repeatedly with out cycling the fan. I may be miss-interpreting it though...
Joseph
Hi Joseph, hope you are having a nice day
On 12-Mar-05 At About 21:08:42, Joseph wrote to All Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
J> From: "Joseph"
SB>> From: Steve B.
SB>> Take the pleated filter out and replace with the kind you used to SB>> have and see if the problem goes away.
J> If the system is cycling on high limit it is possibly an airflow J> problem. If the HO were to remove the filter and it works normally, J> the problem may not be solved but it would be identified, no?
if you read the original. by what he describes the burner doesn't run long enough for the fan to even come on.
-=> HvacTech2
Hi Joseph, hope you are having a nice day
On 13-Mar-05 At About 00:50:50, Joseph wrote to All Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
J> From: "Joseph"
J>> From: "Joseph"
J>> If the system is cycling on high limit it is possibly an airflow J>> problem. If the HO were to remove the filter and it works normally, J>> the problem may not be solved but it would be identified, J>> no?
J> I just reread the OP's posts and it seems clear to me that it is up J> and burning and the fan is running when it kicks out repeatedly with J> out cycling the fan. I may be miss-interpreting it though...
It is quite hard to try to troubleshoot over the net. That is why I usually recommend a call to a local company. there just isn't any way to get a correct answer when the person you are writing to doesn't understand the terminology or correct operating sequence. I could be wrong be I thought he said it cycled several times before the fan even came on.
-=> HvacTech2
How much of a pressure drop is that. How much would that extra resistance raise the TD?
Hi stretch, 3m pleated, right after I replied to HvacTech2 I read your post and figured what the heck. Went down the basement and got the old fiberglass filter and tapped out the loose gunk, put it back in and turned up the stat. Sat there and watched it. The burner did cycle on a second time but then I remembered the vent on the side of the cold air return at the furnace had been closed off when some work was done on the house cause of code, but the guy left it so it could be opened and said if you ever have trouble you can open it. About 3 seconds after I opened it the burner shut off and there was not a third or fourth burn. Right now it is hotter than hell in here and the wood stove is going. Will try it in morning and see if it's back to 1 burn. Going to have the Tech out anyway to check things out for safety's sake.
Stone
I tested air filters at my family's old company. I used 20 x 20 x 1 filters in a test stand. I used 800 CFM as a standart air flow, using a flow hood to measure air flow and a damper to control it. A standard fiberglass filter had a pressure drop of 0.75 to 0,8 inches water column (IWC) at 800 CFM. all the 1" thick pleated filters that I tested had a pressure drop of 0.2 Inches Water Column. That is 2-1/2 times as much as a standard fiberglass filter! After being used in our HVAC system for three months as recommended by the filter manufacturer, the pressure drop on one of them was 0.35 IWC! I wrote an article about my experience and it was published in the October 1999 issue of Contracting Business Magazine. I can email you a copy of the article if you can send me a copy of your email address that I can read.
Stretch
843-385-2220 O'Neill Bagwell Cooling & Heating sixfoot7 @ sccoast . net
Hi Gary, hope you are having a nice day
On 11-Mar-05 At About 22:25:04, Gary Stone wrote to Gary Stone Subject: Furnace cycling
GS> From: "Gary Stone"
GS> Hi, I've got a forced air propane furnace, Luxaire model GSU082MF GS> Series NAGOE (could be a Q) serial #1310002 Controlled by a Honeywell GS> T87F heat only thermostat. This morning I was down in the basement GS> and noticed that it had the initial ignition then that cut off after GS> a while (normal burn) then a couple of minutes later a second GS> ignition which ran a couple of minutes, when that cut off I headed GS> up the stairs only to hear it kick in a third time for a couple GS> of minutes. Total time for this was about 10 to 13 minutes. Before GS> I went down there I had moved the thermostat only to the point which GS> it kicked in, 60º F from 58º F so, it wasn't that drastic a jump. GS> Yeah, I like it on the cool side. The outside temp was 19º F. I do GS> not remember it ever acting in this manner and suspect there might GS> be a problem, Yes? No? Thanks for any input.
GS> Stone
have you moved or made any adjustments to the thermostat? if not it could be a sign of unit failure coming. Do you have normal maintenance done? if not it may be time to have it cleaned and tuned.
-=> HvacTech2
Hi William, hope you are having a nice day
On 11-Mar-05 At About 23:11:13, William W. Plummer wrote to All Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
WWP> From: "William W. Plummer"
WWP> Gary St WWP> My guess is the "stack cutoff" sensor is bad. The idea is that WWP> shortly after the ignition goes on, the gas should lite and heat up WWP> the stack. If it doesn't, the ignition will be killed. But after WWP> several tries, it gets warm enough to stay on. Maybe the cold WWP> outside temp has something to do with it.
This is not the way ignition occurs. the way a pilot is sensed is called flame rectification. the only thing that comes close to what you are saying is the limit switch which has a totally different purpose.
WWP> The sensor probably needs to be replaced. It's a safety-related item WWP> and the repair should be done by a licensed professional.
this is true of any safety device such as the limit.
-=> HvacTech2
Hi Gary, hope you are having a nice day
On 12-Mar-05 At About 02:32:47, Gary Stone wrote to Gary Stone Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
GS> From: "Gary Stone"
You have to be careful about following any advice given in a NG as some well meaning people can cause more problems than you had to start with. changing the anticipator could actually burn up the thermostat if done wrong.
-=> HvacTech2
Hi Scootz, hope you are having a nice day
On 12-Mar-05 At About 11:18:23, Scootz wrote to All Subject: Re: Furnace cycling
S> From: Scootz
S> yes, it could make it cycle worse. i did not say it would fix it. his S> prob could very well be any number of furnace part related probs.
S> this was just a suggestion for a easy check he could do himself. all S> the heat anticipator setting is for is to match the amp draw thro S> the thermostat for correct
This part is correct.
S> furnace cycles. most run around 4 or 6 on S> the settings.
This part is not correct. the setting should match the actual amp draw. not "around" a setting.
S> for some strange reason, the pointer seems to get moved occasionally.
They do not "move" themselves. someone has to do it physically.
S> ive adjusted quite a few of them and that turned out to be the only S> problem. as for burning it out just by changing the setting, S> its not very likely.
it will burn out if you go too low on the setting.
S> usually the only thing that will burn it out S> is a low voltage short from the furnace controls or a high voltage S> related surge thro the thermostat wire.
see above.
S> at any rate, the best thing to do is to call a reputable serv comp S> and let a tech take a look at it.
Another true statement.
-=> HvacTech2
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