Electrical Neutral Connected to Ground

[dpb]

That's the point though, there's only the one device here.

[Jerry.Tan]

And that outlet is probably wired with #12 or #14 wire, which is connected to a 40A or 50A breaker. And likely they have copper wire to the outlet connected to Alum wire, which is likely to corrode due to the dialectric action of different metals.

What are you going to do, check the connections every day? I'd get that separate circuit installed THIS WEEK or sooner.

In that case, the whole house might burn to the ground.

Your house could be the FIRST one to burn.

Consider this. The Microwave (MW) develops a problem, causing a dead short. There is no properly sized breaker to trip. Several things can happen. If you're lucky. only the MW will be destroyed as smoke pours out of it, making it hard to breathe and sooting up the house, until it finally burns the internal wires and components enough to be disconnected from the power. -OR- If you're not so lucky, the unprotected #12 or #14 wires to that outlet ignite, setting the house on fire, destroying your home. It's a gamble, and with Alum wire, the odds are NOT in your favor. So, you might want to have some marshmallows handy to roast as your home burns to the ground.

I have not addressed any possible electrocution issues in this reply.

As another poster said "the person who wired that should be in jail".

[Jerry.Tan]

Stoves like that have an internal 15A or 20A fuse or breaker for those built in 120V devices. What the OP said, the outlet is wired directly to the RANGE outlet. THere is no smaller fuse or breaker. BIG DIFFERENCE!

[micky]

I never thought an outlet on the stove was a great idea. Eventually someone will turn the burner on when an electric cord is going over the burner.

I actually live in the next county (I think).

[Dick]

Maybe we shouldn't put burners on the stove top because some dumbass democrat will burn themselves? And maybe limit the oven temp to 120F?

[gfretwell]

Even back when it was legal, there were still some restrictions. It had to originate in the main panel, not a sub, and the grounded conductor was required to be insulated if this was not SE cable. That usually meant they ran 10 or 8 3 wire romex plus ground so the ground wire was still there, just nod connected to the receptacle, that got the red, black and white. Typically they used it to ground the box.

[trader_4]

Copper 14g is 2.5 ohms per 1000 ft, or .0025 per ft. At 40 amps, I2R is 1600 x .0025, or 4 watts per foot. You have two conductors, so double that, 8W. 8W spread out over a foot of wire doesn't sound like a lot of heat to me either. Like you say, warm, but I doubt it would melt romex insulation. There is a lot of margin in the code.

I agree, especially now that he knows not to plug another big load into that same receptacle with the microwave.

[dpb]

...

Thanks for the update--I couldn't recall well enough to venture w/o looking it up and didn't want to take the time/effort at the time.

Well, let's see if can do a little more on the temperature rise given the heat load...

Well, shoot! Can't find in a quick search any specifically applicable heat transfer coefficients for romex so it'll have to wait until can find more time...by which time I'll likely have lost interest! :)

[bubba]

What does this have to do with Democrats? You need full-time therapy.

[Stormin Mormon]

Another moaners hub poster, displaying intelligence.

Yep, aluminum wiring and no problems. Yet.

- . Christopher A. Young learn more about Jesus .

. .

[dpb]

On 03/11/2015 5:13 PM, dpb wrote: ...

I've lost interest...but, I did find one study that bundled 12(!!!) various-sized cables from 14 to 10ga in a single bundle through a top plate hole as constricted as possible yet get them through it.

They then powered each and every circuit to it's 80% rating by adjusting a bunch of resistance heat loads and watched. It raised the temperature to above the 90C (~200F) rating temperature after a period of several hours from which they concluded this was a bad idea and Code should prevent it! (DOH!)

OBTW, this was on an experimental structure of a west-facing wall in the AZ desert at full summer sun...

[gfretwell]

Check out 334.80, It has been in the code for several cycles.

Where more than two NM cables containing two or more current-carrying conductors are installed, without maintaining spacing between the cables, through the same opening in wood framing that is to be fire- or draft-stopped using thermal insulation, caulk, or sealing foam, the allowable ampacity of each conductor shall be adjusted in accordance with Table 310.15(B)(2)(a) and the provisions of 310.15(A)(2), Exception, shall not apply.

[dpb]

I'm aware of it, just reporting the story of an "experiment" as, basically, "jobsite" humor...but, apparently these nitwits weren't.