asphalt shingle question

[tom]

[tom]

Yes, the manufacturer does print "Do not remove" on the release film, but they could just as well print "Need not remove". You're right about the film preventing the shingles from sticking together while in the bundle, but I don't follow your reasoning later on in your post regarding replacement. Or the wind issue, either. This myth has been beaten to death all over this forum, anyway. Tom Mois=E9s Nacio wrote: > The tape stays on, it's not supposed to be removed. In fact, the shingle

[Moisés Nacio]

"tom" wrote Well, you've got maybe 10 years on me, and I also did just that; Fixed other roofers' mistakes. Will you please explain to me the effect that removing the release tape has on shingle removal? Tom

Tom,

I'm not going into great detail, but the tidbits I list, all have a bearing on the end result.

You may or may not know, major manufacturers, manufacture covering for different regions. Usually about half a dozen regions in the United States. There's not one shingle that is formulated/manufactured to be used across the entire country, by any major manufacturer. Although, I know of one that breaks down the USA into 3 regions.

One manufacture in particular, has a huge problem of keeping their product straight for packaging. You probably ran across this one in your time, where shingles are stuck together, simply because the product wasn't straight when it was packaged.

Quality control fluctuates even in ISO certified conditions.

The adhesive put on the back on the covering for the release tape also will fluctuate, once in awhile there are excessive amounts beyond the amount called in the specifications to keep the release tape on, more often than not, this seems like a normal amount.

For the average 3 tab 12x36 shingle, installed for average pitch/climate conditions, there will be 8 nails in it. As you know, you must remove the nails from the shingle/s above and adjoining the deficient shingle. You also must break the tar _seal_ with a flat bar, which is best done with the covering cool. Now, if the release tape has been removed, and the adhesive was excessive either by intention or by fluctuation, you now have another area which has sealed. The problem is, you must get the flat bar under a full 7" or 2" above the keyway. Problem is, if this is done when it is cool, and the covering has lost flexibility to where you can't bend tabs without breaking, it creates an additional barrier in which you must work around. I won't even go into the problem of replacements when the covering is hot, and adhesive is sticky.

Manufacturers spend millions of dollars for design, although some spend more in advertising than in product design. When you see the product is manufactured with tolerances of +/- 1/4", it is the manufacture who spent on advertising, instead of design.

A quality roofing product is designed so the entire roof doesn't come off in highwinds, of course there is only so much of a guarantee the manufacturer can be liable for.

I did a lot of work in my days, in tornado alley. I seen some installers trying experiments on structures, selling it as snake oil. I've worked on countless structures, where removal of release tape caused problems.

You of course, apparently never ran into a problem when the release tape had been removed. I find that interesting.

[Harry K]

Sorta sticking my nose in here.

Wouldn't there be a warrantee problem were it removed? The tape says 'do not remove', it is removed, the roof fails, the manufacturer says 'not installed per spec'.

Harry K

[tom]

It's nice to hear from a roofer who's erudite. You've explained your reasoning well. I've had my share of difficult tear-offs, especially when I'd wanted to be kind to the neighboring shingles, but doesn't it seem that the instance you've given is more of an exception than the rule? I roofed in my home state of Michigan for 20+ years, before "retiring" to AZ. Granted, "Tornado Alley" it wasn't. Get this: Here in AZ, the roofing suppliers have _never_even_heard_of step flashing! I have to cut and bend my own. It appears that roofers here just goop it to the wall!!! One can make a pretty good living off most of the roofers of today. Tom Mois=E9s Nacio wrote: > Tom,

[tom]

I'd have a problem with that kind of picayune response from a manufacturer. Tom Harry K wrote: > Sorta sticking my nose in here.

[Moisés Nacio]

Harry,

Technically, when the product specifies "do not remove", I would say yes. But, I never ran across a scenario where the manufacturer was involved in such a instance. Most of the roofs I'd seen, where the release tape was removed, and considerable covering was literally peeled and rolled, the insurance companies were involved to cover the damage.

[Moisés Nacio]

"tom" wrote >

I'm not surprised.

Truthfully, I miss all the brake work I did. I took a lot of pride in my bends, most people wouldn't even notice. To me, it was like an art.

Those days are gone, but not forgotten.

[tom]

[Larry Jaques]

On Fri, 07 Jul 2006 02:13:02 GMT, with neither quill nor qualm, "Moisés Nacio" quickly quoth:

I watched a This Old House Classic a few months back and a guy was fabbing and installing copper roof flashing. He had an aluminum brake that was portable, but it was 10 or 12 feet long. Google "tapco" for all sorts of cool tools.

[al]

I came across some of this "release film" working in the yard yesterday, so I emailed GAF to inquire about this issue with respect to their Royal Sovereign shingles and here is the main text of their response:

"Thank you for your inquiry.

I have attached a Technical Bulletin regarding the release film on shingles.

As the bulletin indicates, it is not necessary to remove this film. The film strips you see in your yard could possible be from the old shingles that were removed. If by some chance these are film strips from the new shingles, no harm is done.

If you have any questions, please contact us."

[Jimmie D]

No there is no need to remove the tape, Well almost none, If it is left on the gable end pieces it can rattle in the wind.

[localhandyhelpers]

The asphalt strip is covered with a thin cellophane layer to protect the shingles from adhering to each other during shipment and storage. When a roof gets hot from the sun some of the tar melts out and adheres to the shingle below it. A little asphalt goes a long ways. Removing the cellophane is not neccesary. When shingles first came out, a roofer would have to add a small splatering of tare under each shingle. This was very time consuming and a real pain. It did'nt take long to figure out they could pre-apply the asphalt, but needed the cellophane to protect the shingles from sticking to each other for shipment and storage. Hope this helps. Neighbors helping neighbors at localhandyhelpers.com