finish question

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Howdy,
Well, you are getting ready for it...
Writing the sort of words above has to help. Thanks for posting it.
All the best,
--
Kenneth

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Hi Mike
In regards to flooding and letting an application cure. Kenneth pretty much hit the nail on the head.
You may notice that when you apply the first coat of oil that some parts of the wood looked glossy and wet while some went right to dull and uninteresting. It's more noticeable on some woods then others.
However what you are seeing is the different densities of the wood and how quickly the different parts soak up the oil. As and alternative to flooding and wasting the finish you can get good results by observing the phenomena and, during the set and soak time applying more oil to those dull areas.
What happens after the manufacturers suggested wait time till more is added is that the oil cures and seals the cells which prevents the new coats from penetrating any further into the wood.
If you don't give it enough time to cure the wood will be like a sponge and will continue to soak up the oil like a sponge.
Good Luck
--
Mike G.
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Just for informational purposes.
It is not unusual, when someone is going to put on a surface film finish, to use an initial coat or two of oil to enhance the grain, the so called process of popping the grain.
Applying five coats of oil for the effect would be excessive but not harmfully so. One or, at most, two, would be sufficient.
My personal opinion is that, since oil based varnish already has oil in it the same effect can be achieved with a thinned sealer coat of oil based varnish. . What would befit from the application would be water based varnishes.
I also don't like the effect on very light wood since the yellowing puts me in mind of "yellow snow". Now, on a darker wood such as walnut or mahogany it's a different story.
However, that is only my opinion/taste and not to be taken as condemnation of those who may disagree. .
In general I'd say that the use of a surface finish over an oil finish is a harmless exercise with some possible befits, but the use of two different surface finishes, say varnish over shellac, is, at best, a non productive waste of time, at worse, a recipe for disaster.
Note, when I say varnish over shellac I am alluding too a built up shellac finish and not a sealer coat of thinned shellac.
Just some thoughts
--
Mike G.
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me
Do you consider cherry a light wood? I've been extremely satisfied with how nicely the watco oil/varnish has darkened the cherry. I'm sure this can vary quite a bit depending on the board or even within the board, especially with cherry. The main reason I've added more coats of oil is that I've been able to see subtle effects from doing so. You're probably correct that if I want to put a urethane or something on top, 5 coats might be overdoing it, especially since the overall appearance is likely to be affected anyway.
Anyway, I'm curious about your suggestion for "3 coats of wax". Another poster questioned the need for ANY wax, let alone multiple coats. I admit that when I've used wax, I only put one coat. What's the rationale for multiple coats? Do you put one on and wait a day or just wax/buff/wax/buff/etc. without appreciable waiting time?
The maple bed I made that had oil/varnish as the top coat was waxed over a year ago (one coat of antiquewax) and it has held up wonderfully without any additional waxing.
Mike
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Hi Mike
About the cherry all I can say is that I'd have to have the wood in front of me so I could test it with some oil. Cherry can have enough color to get away with it but not always. But please, make your own judgments on that. It is just a personal opinion of mine and depends greatly on the wood tone I have to work with.
In matters of taste in styles, colors, etc do tests on scrap, please yourself, and hang everyone else. That is, of course, unless everyone else is the better half or someone paying for the job.
As for wax. My opinion is that all finishes benefit from wax in more then just looks and I consider three coats optimum. Actually, after three coats your wasting your time putting more on because by then all the little imperfections have been filled and you are pretty much, well, to steal a quote, doing "wax on/wax off"
While wax itself offers practically no protection to wood by itself it does do a fair job of protecting a finish. It acts as a lubricant protecting a finish from the day to day action of collecting scratches as items are slid over the surface of the finish. This helps minimize wear and tear of the finish itself and the build up of micro scratches that will eventually dull a finish. It fills pours in open pored wood finished with an oil finish or a surface finish that has not had the pores filled. This keeps crud from building up. It collects general house hold grunge. It acts as a temporary barrier keeping moisture from the finish long enough so it can be wiped up.
And, after it's done all that you can remove all the collected gunk and rejuvenate the sheen by simply rewaxing. Since wax never cures hard, new coats of wax dissolve previous coats and the gunk gets wiped off as you rewax. Eventually, depending on conditions, the initial coat of wax and the rewaxing reaches a point of diminishing returns and the wax has to be stripped and a fresh clean base coat added but you're only talking once or twice a year, maybe less.
As for someone saying wax not needed. I have to wonder if they wax their car to protect the finish. I know an awful lot of people who do, even people with expensive custom jobs.
Hope it helps
--
Mike G.
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On Tue, 27 Apr 2004 12:27:32 -0400, "Mike G"

Unless you're using the shellac as a barrier coat for some reason.
Shellac is a pretty much a universal barrier and is compatible with just about anything.
Barry
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24 hours later I still say to try water based poly <G>
It makes clean-up a breeze on anything that might need clean-up (like a high chair or a kitchen waste basket surround).
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Hi Tom,
Sorry I didn't respond to you earlier. I mentioned my experience with WB topcoats (specifically General Finishes polyacrylic blend) and I was quite happy with it. The one caveat is that I used it with water-based stain. I realize if I let the oil/varnish completely cure that I should have no problems with the water-based poly over it. At this point, I think I'm going to try to go with just waxing the danish oil finish thoroughly and see how that works. The main problem I would anticipate with a poly top coat on something like this is the potential for severe scratching from the little guy banging his utensils and bowls, etc. The ease of repairing the oil finish is appealing to me.
Mike
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On Wed, 28 Apr 2004 01:49:13 GMT, "Tom Kohlman"

I agree, but the water base I've seen give the wood an artificial tone. Some of the better stuff is now available with ambering additives that seem to make them look more like solvent based products after curing.
I _love_ water base finishes on woods that I want to stay very light and bright, like natural birch, light ash, and bright maple.
Barry
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