Leaking Flofit pushfits - 50% failure rate

[mike]

I've just lifted some floorboards in the kitchen and found that three of the six readily accessible Flofit 90 degree bends I installed three months ago are leaking. There are more hidden under the floorboards but I can't get to them without ripping out half the kitchen.

My first thought was that I'd done something wrong but I've used JG Speedfit before without problems, and these were fitted onto virgin copper pipe, cut with a pipe slice and installed carefully.

Because Google still haven't fixed the UK-DIY archive search, I went over to the Screwfix forums to see if anyone else had had problems. It seems that a fair few have and that Flofit is getting a pretty poor name for itself.

Various suggestions have been made for why they fail: they're OK on plastic pipe but don't like copper; they don't like imperial copper; it's mainly the 90 degree bends that fail; it was a bad batch.... and my favourite: they're just crap.

Apparently, the manufacturer, FloPlast, has blamed microscopic dirt "so small you can't see it", which seems a bit like blaming the pixies. Anyway, other manufacturers' stuff seems to work OK.

I dismantled them (which wasn't anywhere near as easy as JG) and found that the rubber rings inside seem to have reacted with the copper pipe leaving a band of rubber that had to be sanded off.

I actually saw one of the fittings emitting pulses of water each time a tap was turned off - this despite the fact that it was pushed securely and fully home and the collar was in place.

I'm in the process of replacing them with compressions and considering how best to get rid of the remaining hidden ones with the minimum of disruption.

Obviously, I'll never use the buggers again but is it reasonable to take the matter up with Screwfix where I bought them from?

I bought =A3140 worth of fittings, inserts and pipe in July of last year got round to installing the first of them three months ago and have just found out they've failed.

The fact that others are reporting similar problems and it's not just a one-off seems to back-up the idea that it's either a bad batch or a flawed design.

What would the panel do?

Ta for your thoughts.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Use end feed solder fittings. It may take longer but is tried and tested technology. Anything relying on a 'rubber' ring to seal *will* fail at some time.

[Calvin Sambrook]

Don't forget that the Sale of Goods Act et al gives you statutory rights for (up to) six years assuming you are a consumer, ie. you didn't use these as part of a business. Although you are past the 6 month "reverse burden of proof" stage I can't believe you would have any trouble arguing that it is reasonable for them to last more than 6 years, indeed I'm sure the manufacturer makes such claims.

The SoGA makes it easy for you if you want the parts to be replaced but it doesn't prevent you claiming financial recompense.

[thestraightstory]

So Mike, What happened? What did you end up doing? Did you replace the hidden fittings to? Did ScrewFix reimburse you? Did you go down the route of using the sale of goods act? Did you receive any compensation and if so how did you go about it? I also bought the fittings sometime before fitting them in an attic convers ion. I didn't seem to have much trouble with them and I kept most of the fi ttings accessible in the crawl spaces. However I had about 6 tees within th e floor and then reducers win partitions behind the partitions terminating with the stem elbows. As I done the project gradually I ended up with the water services on in th e autumn 2016 (no leaks) and life got in the way and only got the heating o n in winter 2016. It was in this stage that I was getting failures. 3nr. 15 mm straight connectors (not even to copper but on plastic to plastic with i nserts). Then the 15mm stem elbows to radiators were failing. I filled and drained and refitted and aired and replaced with stem elbows some 5 times e ven buying new ones of a more recent batch but they still dripped/wept. Eve ntually I tried another few different manufacturers on the same pipe to rad iator connections and both had no issue. They worked like they are supposed to. I have no confidence in the Flofit fittings now. I originally purchased the se fittings because they were solid and the fitting couldn't be opened up i n the way other brands could which could have lead to the grippers, washers and o-rings being reassembled in the wrong order if someone was not paying attention/tampered with, or disconnected because they are very hard to rel ease unlike other brands. Because the water services pipes never leaked in spring and were working at a much higher pressure than the heating and showed no leaks. I got the pla stering completed. Now that the heating has leaked with 6 out of 12 fitting s that were finally installed (stem elbows and straights) to connect into t he system. I replaced these 6 fittings with those from other manufacturers and the dripping/weeping stopped. I don't feel confident about any of the o ther fittings on the system (38 other Flofit fittings on water services and heating). I am just astonished at how poor they have been. To replace another fitting with the same and for it still to leak is alarming. You could live with th e odd fitting failing but my ratio has been 12% of all Flofit fittings. I j ust couldn't believe that the manufacturers didn't have stronger quality ch ecks. They don't seem to be fit for purpose with such high failure rates. G iven my experience, and that of Mike's I am surprised ScrewFix still stock and sell them. I did search for the product online before purchasing under reviews and leaks but nothing really came up except for those doing poor wo rk (not straight cuts, not using inserts, fitting to 1/2" copper, etc.). It never occurred to try a search with dripping/leaking- until that's what ha ppened. On a side note it drives me up the wall knowing that I've used other manufa cturers fittings because I can see the differences in them (colour, size, d esign, shape, etc).

[Graham.]

Reply to a 2009 post via GG. Full context here (to coin a phrase)

[Brian Gaff]

So what exactly do you think is wrong with them that only shows up after a time, are they too flexible or do the deform the pipes more than any o ring etc can compensate for? Brian

[Brian Gaff]

Actually though despite the lack of date etc, I'm sure I've read or heard somewhere about this exact problem far more recently. Kind of makes one wonder if anyone really cares any more get em and flog em seems to be the mantra today. Brian