Boiler probs

[IMM]

On insulation?

[Dave Plowman]

But the houses couldn't be identical, now, could they?

Most super insulated houses are timber framed. So have a short life. And frequently require expensive maintenance/repairs.

[Christian McArdle]

No, on fuel. It couldn't be reduced any further, as although the EU allows VAT exemptions on existing products, apparently you aren't allowed to remove VAT from something that is already charged.

The reduction on fuel was a retrograde step, taken because lots of old grannies complained. They'd have been better to implement the winter fuel allowance instead. AIUI, the winter fuel allowance is greater than my entire annual gas bill.

Christian.

[IMM]

I recall the wicked witch Thatcher pandering to her voters here in the south of England (they kept voting her in), and giving them a large fuel allowance, and those in the north of England and Scotland less. The excuse was that in the north of England and Scotland it was colder anyway. Apparently the Merseyside(I read it may change its name to Liverpool Bay)/Deeside region has the same climate as Surrey, Sussex, Kent. This was ignored of course.

[Christian McArdle]

Um, there are plenty of timber framed houses around here many hundreds of years old. A properly built timber framed house will last as long as bricks and mortar.

Christian.

[IMM]

More old wives tales.

The oldest in the UK dates from the 11th century. Go to the old Medieval market town like Ludlow, and see the timber framed house of over 500 years old.

[Huge]

Which bear precisely zero resemblance to the jerry-built "million matchstick" jobs being flung up now.

[Dave Plowman]

Yes, but that's a properly built timber framed house using proper timber. Most these days are neither.

[Christian McArdle]

Well, the 1970s saw a load of nasty ones. Current ones are much better.

OTOH, I prefer masonry anyway. More thermal mass.

Christian.

[IMM]

No proof of that. The number of 1970s timber framed houses that had severe problems is very small, far smaller than masonry built homes.

I prefer timber frame as it allows cellulous insulation to be sprayed into the wall voids, giving superinsulation, air tightness and no full heating system. Thermal mass? In the ground floor and lay sand in the floor voids. This also suppresses sound too, so a double whammy. Much better way all around, especially when using TJI "I" beams.

What a selling point! No full heating system, warm in winter, cool in summer and fully sound suppressed throughout. See if any estate agent would see those benefits and sell accordingly.

[Christian McArdle]

Nah, they'd just knock off several thousand because it doesn't have GCH. Besides, how can it get away with no heating at all? Even with perfect insulation, with no heat source, it will settle to average outside temperature. You can't rely entirely on human heating, as it would take time to heat the thermal mass when you get in. However, it could be a case for electric heating, as the losses are so tiny, that the reduced installation and maintenance cost of a simple electric installation to quickly preheat could outweigh the running cost (and environmental) benefit of gas.

Christian.

[IMM]

Usually a small kickspece fan heater under the stairs is enough to raise the temperature, then people, TVs etc take over. You could have Full passive solar too. In a new house easy to accommodate, with no extra cost.

That is a possibility. You have to do your calcs though. Also most probably less capital cost to install. An air tight house would most probably have a Heat recovery and vent system. It is a matter of having a heater batter in the main duct. I would have a solar collector to assist the electric DHW heating.

Simply spend your money on insulation rather than expensive heating systems. And make sure you have an excellent design, which cost nothing at all.

[The Natural Philosopher]

Ah. Like the timber framed house across the road ,mentioned in teh Domesday book.

Yup. 1000 years is really crap, when stonehenge is over 3000 years old.

Wooden s**te.

And

[The Natural Philosopher]

I prefer wood. Less thermal mass :-)

[Huge]

Irrelevant.

i) Modern houses aren't built from whole oak trees.

ii) You're only looking at the ones that survived; it's a self-selected sample.

[Dave Plowman]

So it's a *super insulated* timber framed house, is it?

[The Natural Philosopher]

Mine is. So are others. Anyway teh bits that go are usually roof timbers due to roofing problems. These are wood even in a block house.

Same with castles built of stone, and stonehenge. Block houses will also fall down if left lonhg enough.