Above-stairs cupboard?

[Geo]

I have been considering (slowly - over several years) using the space above the staircase for a storage cupboard for bed linen etc. The staircase is in between two rooms so has stud and plasterboard walls at 1st floor level. Could anyone who has actually completed a project like this give some help and suggestions - or a link to web info (no success with google so far). The staircase is about 3 feet wide and I estimate that the base of the cupboard would be about waist height in one of the bedrooms and about 3' 6" wide. I am not sure how best to tackle the support of the cupboard base. Battens screwed to the studs would be possible across the stair but difficult at the sides. Would I have to use a plasterboard outer skin for fire protection of would plywood painted with a resistant paint be acceptable?

Geo

[meow2222]

gives built in cupboards plus solves the decorating difficulty above the stairs.

maybe you could then get 2x inbuilt cupboards, each around 18" deep. Or perhaps could step the cupboards so that one half is 2' and the other half 1' deep for each room. Add a rail and you no longer need a free standing wardrobe.

If you remove the PB at the sides where you want the opening, you'll be left with wood uprights and possibly some noggins. You can attach

1.5 x 2.5 timber across these to on each side, then add more wood at 90 degrees across the stairs to create a base holding structure which supports the cupboard base on all 4 edges.

You've got a choice of a flat bottomed cupboard, in which case you lose a lot of space, or a sloped ceiling over the stairs and an angled bottomed cupboard with shelves and/or rails. The difference is with the latter the odd shaped cubby holes are accessible and can be used for some things.

I dont know, but I cant think of any reason to not use PB. Are you thinking of using the one layer to make both ceiling and cupboard interior base? If so I would not do that, as goods are liable to cause sag. Putting the interior base on top of the wood frame means any sag is not communicated to the ceiling, and gives better sound insulation. For a 3' stretch 12mm chip might sag, 18mm might be better..

1" PB, ie 2 layers, gives considerably longer fire protection than 1 layer. Better sound insulation too.

You can retain most of the existing uprights, cutting down a couple to give you 2 decent width doors. Do check the structure above, as sometimes these uprights will be holding some of the loft floor up.

NT

[Lobster]

Not sure how closely this matches your scenario but here's "one I did earlier"!

In my case I was wanting to reclaim the space above the stairwell:

order to make use of it upstairs. On the left of the stairwell (looking down) is an outside wall; on the right is a non-loadbearing wall made of hollow clay bricks. The object was to create another bedroom upstairs, with its window installed in the wall above the stairwell.

I knocked out the wall to the right, and built a platform above the stairs - which is presumably the sort of thing you want to do? Key point here was to draw a line on the wall all the way up the stairs, 2m above the front of the steps and accounting for any bends in the stairs

- this is the line below which the new headroom must not go, or you fall foul of Building Regs. The platform was made of 4x2 joists, and attached to the brickwork with joist hangers:

new sloped ceiling above the stairs maintains the 2m headroom and was constructed in much the same way: this is of any help, let me know what else you need to know!

David

[Keith]

In message , Geo writes

For a wee chuckle google the group for "rope lintel" in the thread "Dumb and Dumber"

[Geo]

Now that was an idea - the sheds have sttel wire and fittings which could hold the chest of drawers up there ...

Geo

[Geo]

useful to point out to my wife the sort of work involved. I don't have the benefit of an outside wall but there is not much chance of either of us climbing up into the cupboard (OAPs) so I will not need as much support as your effort. I may bolt the battens to the studs in the walls but I don't think they make hangers small enough so may have to use some other (TBD) method for suporting the cross pieces. The room has to remain in use (even the carpet stays down) so I will have to make as little mess as possible. Thanks again for the info and making the pics available.

Geo

[Geo]

Just partioned off an alcove in one room for a wardrobe so the storage space is just required for the other room

Considering using coach bolts for fixing the side battens but not sure how to attached the timbers at 90 degrees (without doubling the height)

Wife does not like the sloped ceiling approach as would be like "walking down a tunnel"

I have not used plasterboard before and would probably wreck it trying to fit it above the stairs (old age). Was thinking of mdf for internal "floor", hardboard for internal vertical wall and plywood on the "outside".

I think I can just cut out one stud leaving a gap of about 35". Finding suitable doors seems to be the next problem. B&Q have some "cabinet" doors about the right size but they do not have a wide enough edge for standard door hinges.

Take the point - but I sometimes get the feeling that the walls are stuck to the loft joists and the floor is sinking away from them...

Many thanks for taking the trouble to reply.

Geo

[meow2222]

in that case 3' is deep, and I'd think about how youre going to access that depth.

thats a bit hefty, ordinary woodscrews would be fine.

you mean to attach the ones that run across the stairs? Wood screws are good. Nails would work too but not be half as strong.

Seems to be fine in practice, fwiw

can do, chip's cheaper though

never going to look good. Hardboard isnt rigid enough to support itself, and will sit slightly wavy, and get much worse in time..

Tell you what, why not buy the ply and a sheet of 12mm PB, and try the PB first. Its lighter, can be cut with a stanley knife, and if you screw up youve got the ply. Its so much easier to work with, I reckon you'll have ply left over. Cost you =A33 to find out though.

If the shape is an awkward one, you can use a sheet of cardboard, trim it till its right, then copy the shape in PB.

I think finding them is unlikely, its make your own time. Its quite easy for some styles of door, you will need a plane though. What sort of finish do you want? Melamine, stained wood, pine?

You do need to know, as you might need to add a crosspiece or 2 in the loft.

NT

[Geo]

Should be ok - unused duvet, empty suitcases, rucksacks - mostly bulky stuff usually shoved on top of the wardrobe.

Only 3 studs (each side) so thought 3 screws would be a bit "light" - suppose I could get two in each.

Right - you are thinking diagonal screwing/nailing?

Yes - she visited a neighbour today who had the sloping ceiling and said it was not as bad as expected.

OK

You almost have me convinced - the 9.5mm PB sheet seems light enough for me to handle.

Stained wood or pine would be fine - no problem with hand tools or working wood (although don't want to do a dozen mortice & tenon joints) but the wood I have seen recently is so poor that the chances of creating an unwarped panel door seem slight.

Geo

[meow2222]

2's good, yes.

no, straight through and into the end grain, using a good depth into the end to avoid split off. There are 2 ways to do it, I'll let you draw the diagram :)

Diagonal screwing is much weaker.

go conservative with a ceiling higher than required, and you get a significant amount of extra cubby hole space, good for bedding, jumpers etc.

Lot lighter than ply!

There are much easier ways. The simplest is to use fair faced plywood sheet, varnish the surface and stain the edges dark to hide the stripes.

You could also use pineboard, but it wont be quite as stable as ply. Either way nothing to make, just cut the sheet to size and plane.

You'll need a hinge drill bit for recess adjustable hinges. You'll need the adjustment feature, so these are the hinges to use.

NT

[Geo]

Sorry - I was thinking about adding an extra support aross the middle but I'm ok with that now.

Thanks for all the suggestions - plasterboard now bought! Will take some photos to mark progress over the next few weeks and post them somewhere if I survive..

Geo

[meow2222]

I assumed thats what you meant, all 3 or more of the crosspieces. But I see you've worked it all out.

hehe

NT

[Geo]

Just re-opening the thread to say (thanks to meow222 and Lobster) the job was completed in 4 weeks part-time work. I have put some pictures up to show the progress:-

Thanks guys...

Geo

[John Rumm]

Nice job, well done.

[Lobster]

Great!! the pics gave me a horrible deja-vue feeling...

David

[meow2222]

Nice job Geo, looks very nice.

Do you fancy putting a description of the process & the pics on here:

? NT