tile over vinyl

We are going to be putting in tile in our kitchen. It currently has 2 layers of vinyl flooring. Our intention was to put a substrate of some sort ( 1/2 inch plywood subfloor)and then the tile. The question is; can we do this over the vinyl or must we remove the vinyl first?
Thanks,
Darren
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Darren,
If the vinyl was laid on concrete and is glued down well you can tile right over it with out the plywood. I do this all the time. I did my own house about seven years ago and have had no problems.
AZCRAIG
www.azcraig.us

layers
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Oh boy, here we go again.
First, google "tile over vinyl". Do a LOT of reading. There are many sects of religion on this topic.
Second, it depends most heavily on two things: your subfloor, and how your vinyl is adhered.
Subfloor: you need a really, really solid base under tile. If there's cement underneath this all, that's ideal. If not, it is a judgement call on how solid your subfloor is, and likely best to get an experienced pair of eyes (or two) to help you make that call. From this side of the keyboard, the best (read: most conservative) advice is to add a layer of ply *and* a layer of backerboard. Then you get into height issues (that can be an inch!).
Adhesion: vinyl is commonly glued either at the perimeter (in which case it's easy, so pull it), or everywhere (in which case removal is, at best, just plain difficult, and then there's residue to deal with, since the ideal substrate is not only solid, it is perfectly flat). If the vinyl is well-adhered everywhere, you might consider leaving it.
Or not.
JSH
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ed wrote:

While I like Julie's answer, I would not have bothered to ask the question. I would not want to do all that work and spend all that money only to find out in a few months I made a mistake and should have done it right the first time. Even if it did not fail, I would be wondering if it would. I would do it right and take the old up first.
--
Joseph E. Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math
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Thanks again for the responses. For what it's worth, this is on a 2n'd floor floor (currently wood subfloor). tx

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OK. . . If I glue and screw 1/4 inch particle board over the vinyl, would I be heading in the right direction? Am I cutting too many corners at this point?

layers
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No by all means not particle board. Use Hardibacker.
http://www.jameshardieeu.com/install.html
At recommendation of an installer, instead of screws I used 1-1/4 inch galvanized roofing nails every six inches in every direction.
If you have a Home Depot nearby, they often have classes on laying tile or at least can give you some good pointers..

1/2
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layers
remove the old flooring so you don't end up with a height problem in the adjoining rooms after you install cement board and tile. I like to install cement board with thinset roofing nails to tack it and screws for finishing it.
the sub flooring is very important under tile.
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My only height problem is the dishwasher. If I tile under it, it likely won't fit under the counter. If I tile around it, I won't be able to get it out. Any thoughts?
and thanks again. . .

layers
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1/2
well, you could raise the countertop.
an easier way is to tile up to it. save about 10 sqft of tile so that when it comes time to replace it, you just untile it and retile with the saved tiles.
it's a good idea to save a bunch of tiles anyway from every job. the next guy to own your house will thank you.
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(snip)
Amen to that- that is what the little nooks and crannies in basement are for. When he had his own company, my father always left the partial tile boxes, a few sticks of trim, a couple switch plates, etc, as spares for the owner.
aem sends....
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Thanks everyone. I think I have some good direction. On to my post regarding hot tub wiring. . . . . :-)

layers
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