Nat gas pressure drop vs. pipe length

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wrote:

Is there a similar generator to the one you purchased that is more than 15,000 watts? ================================================ Not that I could find, and not on that site. BUT, since these guys mix'n'match motors/generators all the time, I'm sure they could put one together for a specific order. Don't know how economical it would be, tho.
But when you get to 20,000 W, that's entering water-cooled, 4 cylinder, low rpm territory -- nice to have. You'll see some of those on that site, iirc.
--
EA



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Gunner wrote:

200A is the standard electrical service around here. I've seen homes with electric start power plants that will provide 400A 208 three phase. They also had diesel powered water pumps for each of the 14" water wells for their nursery that they would fire up during power outages. I'm glad that I never had to pay their electric bills!
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wrote:

Which has little to do with what one needs for an emergency generator. It's not the service that counts. It's what you chose to have powered during a power loss. I have 200A. I did fine with a 6KW. A friend has 300A. He got by fine with a 4500KW generator during Sandy. Enough to run two furnaces, 3 refrigerator/freezers, and lights. But then I guess some people need to run all that, plus the jacuzzi, all the ovens, AC, etc, all at the same time. Hell, why not run the furnace and AC at the same time too.
> I've seen homes

Sure you have.

A home with a 400A service, nursery and multiple 14" wells with diesel pumps? Around here we call that a business or a farm, not a residence.
? I'm

What a maroon.
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During ice storm 2003, I was very grateful for my 2500 watt Coleman. An hour of furnace at bedtime sure made life a lot more comfortable. Not sure what I'd do with all of 8 or 12 KW.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
Which has little to do with what one needs for an emergency generator. It's not the service that counts. It's what you chose to have powered during a power loss. I have 200A. I did fine with a 6KW. A friend has 300A. He got by fine with a 4500KW generator during Sandy. Enough to run two furnaces, 3 refrigerator/freezers, and lights.
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On Jan 10, 8:23 pm, "Stormin Mormon"

I guess you and I are just simple folk. :) It's the old rule where you can get usually get 90% of what is important for not all that much, but it costs a LOT more to get that other 10%. We've figured out we can still live comfortably on 2.5 - 5KW.
Actually, I was amazed at how little it takes to run most things. Before investing in a genset, the first thing I'd recommend is buying a $25 KillaWatt meter and doing some measuring. For example, I bet a lot of folks here don't realize a fridge of the last decade or so only pulls 90 watts running. And then you have CFLs that pull very little.
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On 1/10/2013 5:54 PM, snipped-for-privacy@optonline.net wrote:

the biggest loads that don't unplug or run on 220. You can get most of the info with a stopwatch and the utility meter as you switch stuff on and off.
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The small generator that easily handles my normal electical demand during a power outage won't start the motor on my washing machine, so I picked up an old 3750W / 3000W Coleman cheap at a flea market and rejetted the carb to run smoothly on 10% EtOH gas.
The Maytag's motor requires at least 25A to start. Once running it draws between 500W and 800W. 3750W should be enough, 31A at 120V, but the motor needs its high starting current longer than the generator can provide it unless I push the motor slide in with my toe to loosen the drive belt. The generator appears to current limit at around 25-26A on a steady load, before the breaker pops or the engine slows down.
My KAW doesn't help at all to determine the peak starting current. For that I need an Amprobe with a mechanical meter movement. jsw
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Did you actually try the 3750 on the washing machine? Makes me wonder, if my 2500 will run my ancient Whirlpool washing machine. Be nice to know, someday.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
wrote in message The small generator that easily handles my normal electical demand during a power outage won't start the motor on my washing machine, so I picked up an old 3750W / 3000W Coleman cheap at a flea market and rejetted the carb to run smoothly on 10% EtOH gas.
The Maytag's motor requires at least 25A to start. Once running it draws between 500W and 800W. 3750W should be enough, 31A at 120V, but the motor needs its high starting current longer than the generator can provide it unless I push the motor slide in with my toe to loosen the drive belt. The generator appears to current limit at around 25-26A on a steady load, before the breaker pops or the engine slows down.
My KAW doesn't help at all to determine the peak starting current. For that I need an Amprobe with a mechanical meter movement. jsw
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Try rereading what I wrote.
I had to stop the wash cycle before it ended and tried to start up on spin. Instead I advanced the timer to the final spin cycle so it would empty the tub and then stop completely when finished. Then I rinsed the soap out manually with a hose and reran the final spin cycle. jsw
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I can confirm that experience. Neighbor had a 4500W and the one load it would not run was the washing machine. It could handle two modern gas furnaces, 5 fridge/freezers, lights, etc all at the same time, but not the washing machine. Personally, I would not even attempt it. Doesn't make a lot of sense to me to push a generator during an outage when you need it for furnace, freezers, lights, etc. Seems you should be able to get by for a week or so without running a wash. And if you lose the generator you're really screwed.
Also, a big problem with these generators is unless you pay a lot for say a Honda or Yamaha, you don't know what you got. The typical ones are made from a variety of Chinese engines and Chinese generators, with just sheet metal and paint distinguishing them. They go for mabye $700 for a 5KW. On the other hand, you could pay $4000 for a Honda with less output. It comes down to price vs reliability, how essential it is to you, etc. Best low end strategy is probably to buy a Briggs and Stratton or Troybilt. Even though I believe they are still made in China or use major Chinese components, you have a brand name company which hopefully means somebody is watching the quality at least a bit.....
And for washing machines there are other options. During Sandy, Tide was set up here in NJ at Lowes with a tractor trailer full of washing machines where you could do your wash. Apparently they go to disaster areas like this to provide the service.
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My strategy is to have spares of the few things I really need. I have a small, noisy Kohler generator that is one-hand portable up a ladder, a 1600W one that's two-hand portable for short distances, and the 3750 Coleman that I can barely lift into the car. All were used, cheap, and ran enough to show they were repairable. I didn't realize how much stuff Americans dump into landfills until I lived in Germany, where they don't create 1/4 as much trash.
I tested the Coleman for max capacity on a nice sunny day with no storms predicted. It will run my window air conditioner as long as the A/C can cycle normally. The starting load is too much when I don't wait long enough for the pressure to drop after shutting it off. Likewise I have to loosen the head outlet pipe on my 1/2HP air compressor to let the generator start it. jsw
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Stormin Mormon wrote:

I went for a month without gas service in Ohio after the old line ruptured. Nothing but a 500 space heater blowing under the bed at night. I wouldn't leave it on while I was at work, and I was working doubles seven days a week.
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Sounds like that got seriously cold. I sometimes wonder if I should preheat my bed with a hair dryer for a few minutes, before climbing in.
I had a similar moment when the draft inducer fan in my furnace wore out. Wore right through the side of the housing, a sight to see. Anyhow. I tried to heat for a couple days with gas range burners, and electric heaters. Not very successful, for sure.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
I went for a month without gas service in Ohio after the old line ruptured. Nothing but a 500 space heater blowing under the bed at night. I wouldn't leave it on while I was at work, and I was working doubles seven days a week.
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I got a heated mattress pad for Christmas that still has an effective preheat setting although it meets the Non-Hazardous UL spec. jsw
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Jim Wilkins wrote:

I have to sleep in a hospital bed these days, and have trouble keeping sheets on the bed at night because my feet are 24 inches above my back. I bet I'd slide right into the floor with another layer. :(
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That's got to do strange things for your circulation and your pulmonary, also.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .

I have to sleep in a hospital bed these days, and have trouble keeping sheets on the bed at night because my feet are 24 inches above my back. I bet I'd slide right into the floor with another layer. :(
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Stormin Mormon wrote:

It relieves the swelling that occurs when I'm not in bed. It also causes my kidneys to work harder to remove the excess fluid, and several trips to the bathroom to keep my bladder from escaping during the night. :(
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On 1/11/2013 9:03 PM, Michael A. Terrell wrote:

Have you measured your urine output? My doctor had me keep track of mine and it averaged 2gal a day. I have a couple of those graduated urinal bottles that you get at the hospital. Every time Mr. Bladder woke me up last night it was 500cc/16oz. In 2011 I wound up in the hospital with pneumonia and after getting home I couldn't seem to get better then one day I started swelling up. It started in my legs and crept up to the middle of my abdomen until it looked like I was wearing clown pants, I also had fluid in my lungs. I called my doctor friend, told I had tried my roommate's diuretic which had been proscribed for me before and it helped. I discussed with the doctor what dosages I needed, he called it in and I started taking a double dose of HCTZ and Lisinopril which caused me to drop 50lbs in two weeks, over 60lbs in the month. It was all fluid and my blood pressure dropped so low I was getting dizzy. My blood pressure tested perfect for a skinny 16 year old schoolgirl. My BP was so low I had to be careful how fast I stood up. ^_^
TDD
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The Daring Dufas wrote:

Usually around three liters a day in summer, less in winter. I've had the problem for about 10 years now.

As long as you don't dress like a skinny, 16 year old schoolgirl. ;-)

Some days I think I need to get a lift chair. The damn computer desk chairs are the worst. All of them are too low and I have a hell of a time standing most days. The thick hospital bed mattress is about right, but two inches higher would help.
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Sounds like you'd want to keep and eye on three data points. Fluid input, output, and body weight. Of course, some fluid is lost through perspiration and respiration, but the rest is either edema or urinary output.
Type of beverage would make a difference, water versus orange juice versus beer, versus coffee, or red wine. Some are "water negative" diuretic.
Figured it's time for a subject line change.
Christopher A. Young Learn more about Jesus www.lds.org .
Have you measured your urine output? My doctor had me keep track of mine and it averaged 2gal a day. I have a couple of those graduated urinal bottles that you get at the hospital. Every time Mr. Bladder woke me up last night it was 500cc/16oz. In 2011 I wound up in the hospital with pneumonia and after getting home I couldn't seem to get better then one day I started swelling up. It started in my legs and crept up to the middle of my abdomen until it looked like I was wearing clown pants, I also had fluid in my lungs. I called my doctor friend, told I had tried my roommate's diuretic which had been proscribed for me before and it helped. I discussed with the doctor what dosages I needed, he called it in and I started taking a double dose of HCTZ and Lisinopril which caused me to drop 50lbs in two weeks, over 60lbs in the month. It was all fluid and my blood pressure dropped so low I was getting dizzy. My blood pressure tested perfect for a skinny 16 year old schoolgirl. My BP was so low I had to be careful how fast I stood up. ^_^
TDD
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