How can I tell whether speaker wire is 14 gauge?

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On Sat, 21 Jan 2012 18:37:31 -0800 (PST), ChrisCoaster

It's important to have high quality equipment.
I found ut that the AC plug on the end of my AC cords were not heavy duty enough and were not gold-plated. For only 25 dollars a piece, I could get new AC plugs for my TV, Audio Receiver, Amp, and Equilizer.
Now it turns out I Have to buy a gold-plated electric receptacle, so that I get good electrical connections on both halves of the connection. $45 but I only need one.
I may have to replace the wire from the plugs to the boxes, but that should only be another 20 dollars for each. 45 if I pay someone to do it. But if you want good sound and good picture, you need good electricity.
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wrote:

harmonics will damage your ears. Getting the oxygen out has to be a difficult process, judging by the premium they charge for the wire.
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wrote:

Do not forget to get enough oxygen free wire to go to the breaker, a super breaker, and enough wire to reach from your house to the power generating station.. YOu do not want the electrons in the copper contaminated with the oxygen :-))
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On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 17:28:04 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"

electronics advisor. I'm gettting very annoyed that he didn't tell me about this.
But if I work enough overtime this month, I guess I can afford it.
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ChrisCoaster wrote:

Heh! Want to have some fun? Read the letter from Tartan Cable's president to the lawyers representing Monster Cable. Here's a couple of bits:
"Dear Monster Lawyers,
"Let me begin by stating, without equivocation, that I have no interest whatsoever in infringing upon any intellectual property belonging to Monster Cable. Indeed, the less my customers think my products resemble Monster's, in form or in function, the better."
and
"I say this because my observation has been that Monster Cable typically operates in a hit-and-run fashion. Your client threatens litigation, expecting the victim to panic and plead for mercy; and what follows is a quickie negotiation session that ends with payment and a licensing agreement. Your client then uses this collection of licensing agreements to convince others under similar threat to accede to its demands. Let me be clear about this: there are only two ways for you to get anything out of me. You will either need to (1) convince me that I have infringed, or (2) obtain a final judgment to that effect from a court of competent jurisdiction."
Read the whole (long) thing: http://www.audioholics.com/news/industry-news/blue-jeans-strikes-back
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On 1/21/2012 5:32 AM, HeyBub wrote:

HA! that's a good read! I've known from their inception that monster cables were a scam and couldn't believe ANYone buys their products. But the public is stupid.... GOOD FOR THAT GUY!!
--
Steve Barker
remove the "not" from my address to email
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But

The same public that pushed Gingrich over the top in SC a few hours ago...
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ChrisCoaster wrote:

Well, since God can't be president...
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Why not? You don't think he can PhotoShop a birth certificate?
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On 01/21/2012 11:35 AM, Steve Barker wrote:

I've never bought anything from BJC, but should I decide to take a step up in quality from the Monoprice stuff I've been using for my audio hookup needs, BJC's tech specs and articles on their web site actually pass the sniff test, in a refreshing change from the usual audiophile marketing copy. I ran across them after reading some audio forums for a while and it seems like the consensus was monoprice for consumer grade, BJC for those who insist on high quality, and you'd better make a darn good case for spending more than BJC's prices for any cables. (but of course there are always those who claim to be able to tell the difference.)
nate
--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
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Robert,
I own a wire stripper which is a series of holes, each marked with the gauge. Such strippers are quite common. I'd strip the wire and then pass it through the various holes until I got a close fit. That should be the gauge, near about. The difference between 18 and 14 should be obvious. My tool is a stripper, cutter, crimper, et c. multi-tool.
Dave M.
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The general form factor of mine:
http://www.crimping-tool.com/Cable-Cutter/WX-1041B-cable-cutter-and-wire-stripper.jpg
Strange, I have to use 16AWG slot to avoid stripping strands from 18AWG copper and 14AWG slot to avoid stripping strands from 16AWG and so on.
-CC
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On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 08:44:16 -0800 (PST), ChrisCoaster

depending on the composition of the conductor. Many fine strands is smaller for the same circular mills cross-section than a few heavier strands - and ALL stranded wire will be at least a SMALL amount larger than solid conductor of the same guage.
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On Jan 22, 3:53pm, snipped-for-privacy@snyder.on.ca wrote:

Hence the markings on my stripper - "14AWG Solid <insert conductor here>16AWG Strd"Next ratchet: "12AWG Solid < > 14WG Strd" (this is the one I have to use to strip 16AWG stranded and not see any copper come off with the insulator)
-CC
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<stuff snipped>

That's why I like the weight idea. I've been looking for, but can't find an example of a standard when it comes to evaluating stranded wire gauges, perhaps for the variability reasons you mentioned. Is it the total area of all the strands combined?
-- Bobby G.
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On Sun, 22 Jan 2012 20:36:03 -0500, "Robert Green"

Below is from: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_wire_gauge
By definition, No. 36 AWG is 0.0050 inches in diameter, and No. 0000 is 0.4600 inches in diameter. The ratio of these diameters is 92, and there are 40 gauge sizes from No. 36 to No. 0000, or 39 steps. Using this common ratio, wire gauge sizes vary geometrically according to the following formula: The diameter of a No. n AWG wire is
or equivalently
The gauge can be calculated from the diameter using
[3] and the cross-section area is
, The ASTM B 258-02 standard defines the ratio between successive sizes to be the 39th root of 92, or approximately 1.1229322.[4] ASTM B 258-02 also dictates that wire diameters should be tabulated with no more than 4 significant figures, with a resolution of no more than 0.0001 inches (0.1 mils) for wires larger than No. 44 AWG, and 0.00001 inches (0.01 mils) for wires No. 45 AWG and smaller.
Sizes with multiple zeros are successively larger than No. 0 and can be denoted using "number of zeros/0", for example 4/0 for 0000. For an m/0 AWG wire, use n = -(m-1) = 1-m in the above formulas. For instance, for No. 0000 or 4/0, use n = -3.
[edit] Rules of thumbThe sixth power of this ratio is very close to 2,[5] which leads to the following rules of thumb:
When the diameter of a wire is doubled, the AWG will decrease by 6. (e.g., No. 2 AWG is about twice the diameter of No. 8 AWG.) When the cross-sectional area of a wire is doubled, the AWG will decrease by 3. (e.g., Two No. 14 AWG wires have about the same cross-sectional area as a single No. 11 AWG wire.) Additionally, a decrease of ten gauge numbers, for example from No. 10 to 1/0, multiplies the area and weight by approximately 10 and reduces the resistance by a factor of approximately 10.
[edit] Table of AWG wire sizesThe table below shows various data including both the resistance of the various wire gauges and the allowable current (ampacity) based on plastic insulation. The diameter information in the table applies to solid wires. Stranded wires are calculated by calculating the equivalent cross sectional copper area. Fusing Current (melting wire) is estimated based on 25°C ambient temperature. The table below assumes DC, or AC frequencies equal to or less than 60 Hz, and does not take skin effect into account. Turns of wire is an upper limit for wire with no insulation.
AWG Diameter Turns of wire Area Copper resistance[6] NEC copper wire ampacity with 60/75/90 °C insulation (A)[7] Approximate standard metric equivalents Fusing Current (copper)[8][9] (inch) (mm) (per in) (per cm) (kcmil) (mm2) (O/km) (mO/m) (O/kFT) (mO/ft) Preece (~10s) Onderdonk (1s) Onderdonk (32ms) 0000 (4/0) 0.4600 11.684 2.17 0.856 212 107 0.1608 0.04901 195 / 230 / 260 31 kA 173 kA 000 (3/0) 0.4096 10.404 2.44 0.961 168 85.0 0.2028 0.06180 165 / 200 / 225 24.5 kA 137 kA 00 (2/0) 0.3648 9.266 2.74 1.08 133 67.4 0.2557 0.07793 145 / 175 / 195 19.5 kA 109 kA 0 (1/0) 0.3249 8.252 3.08 1.21 106 53.5 0.3224 0.09827 125 / 150 / 170 1.9 kA 15.5 kA 87 kA 1 0.2893 7.348 3.46 1.36 83.7 42.4 0.4066 0.1239 110 / 130 / 150 1.6 kA 12 kA 68 kA 2 0.2576 6.544 3.88 1.53 66.4 33.6 0.5127 0.1563 95 / 115 / 130 1.3 kA 9.7 kA 54 kA 3 0.2294 5.827 4.36 1.72 52.6 26.7 0.6465 0.1970 85 / 100 / 110 196/0.4 1.1 kA 7.7 kA 43 kA 4 0.2043 5.189 4.89 1.93 41.7 21.2 0.8152 0.2485 70 / 85 / 95 946 A 6.1 kA 34 kA 5 0.1819 4.621 5.50 2.16 33.1 16.8 1.028 0.3133 126/0.4 795 A 4.8 kA 27 kA 6 0.1620 4.115 6.17 2.43 26.3 13.3 1.296 0.3951 55 / 65 / 75 668 A 3.8 kA 21 kA 7 0.1443 3.665 6.93 2.73 20.8 10.5 1.634 0.4982 80/0.4 561 A 3 kA 17 kA 8 0.1285 3.264 7.78 3.06 16.5 8.37 2.061 0.6282 40 / 50 / 55 472 A 2.4 kA 13.5 kA 9 0.1144 2.906 8.74 3.44 13.1 6.63 2.599 0.7921 84/0.3 396 A 1.9 kA 10.7 kA 10 0.1019 2.588 9.81 3.86 10.4 5.26 3.277 0.9989 30 / 35 / 40 333 A 1.5 kA 8.5 kA 11 0.0907 2.305 11.0 4.34 8.23 4.17 4.132 1.260 56/0.3 280 A 1.2 kA 6.7 kA 12 0.0808 2.053 12.4 4.87 6.53 3.31 5.211 1.588 25 / 25 / 30 235A 955 A 5.3 kA 13 0.0720 1.828 13.9 5.47 5.18 2.62 6.571 2.003 50/0.25 198 A 758 A 4.2 kA 14 0.0641 1.628 15.6 6.14 4.11 2.08 8.286 2.525 20 / 20 / 25 166 A 601 A 3.3 kA 15 0.0571 1.450 17.5 6.90 3.26 1.65 10.45 3.184 30/0.25 140 A 477 A 2.7 kA 16 0.0508 1.291 19.7 7.75 2.58 1.31 13.17 4.016 — / — / 18 117 A 377 A 2.1 kA 17 0.0453 1.150 22.1 8.70 2.05 1.04 16.61 5.064 32/0.2 99 A 300 A 1.7 kA 18 0.0403 1.024 24.8 9.77 1.62 0.823 20.95 6.385 — / — / 14 24/0.2 83 A 237A 1.3 kA 19 0.0359 0.912 27.9 11.0 1.29 0.653 26.42 8.051 70 A 189 A 1 kA 20 0.0320 0.812 31.3 12.3 1.02 0.518 33.31 10.15 16/0.2 58.5 A 149 A 834 A 21 0.0285 0.723 35.1 13.8 0.810 0.410 42.00 12.80 13/0.2 49 A 119 A 662 A 22 0.0253 0.644 39.5 15.5 0.642 0.326 52.96 16.14 7/0.25 41 A 94 A 525 A 23 0.0226 0.573 44.3 17.4 0.509 0.258 66.79 20.36 35 A 74 A 416 A 24 0.0201 0.511 49.7 19.6 0.404 0.205 84.22 25.67 1/0.5, 7/0.2, 30/0.1 29 A 59 A 330 A 25 0.0179 0.455 55.9 22.0 0.320 0.162 106.2 32.37 24 A 47 A 262 A 26 0.0159 0.405 62.7 24.7 0.254 0.129 133.9 40.81 1/0.4, 7/0.15 20 A 37 A 208 A 27 0.0142 0.361 70.4 27.7 0.202 0.102 168.9 51.47 28 0.0126 0.321 79.1 31.1 0.160 0.0810 212.9 64.90 7/0.12 29 0.0113 0.286 88.8 35.0 0.127 0.0642 268.5 81.84 30 0.0100 0.255 99.7 39.3 0.101 0.0509 338.6 103.2 1/0.25, 7/0.1 31 0.00893 0.227 112 44.1 0.0797 0.0404 426.9 130.1 32 0.00795 0.202 126 49.5 0.0632 0.0320 538.3 164.1 1/0.2, 7/0.08 33 0.00708 0.180 141 55.6 0.0501 0.0254 678.8 206.9 34 0.00630 0.160 159 62.4 0.0398 0.0201 856.0 260.9 35 0.00561 0.143 178 70.1 0.0315 0.0160 1079 329.0 36 0.00500 0.127 200 78.7 0.0250 0.0127 1361 414.8 37 0.00445 0.113 225 88.4 0.0198 0.0100 1716 523.1 38 0.00397 0.101 252 99.3 0.0157 0.00797 2164 659.6 39 0.00353 0.0897 283 111 0.0125 0.00632 2729 831.8 40
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I've got one of those, and I'll include that test in the photos I am making up to send to Amazon. This is the first time some "marketplace vendor" has tried a "bait and switch" of some sort. Eventually, it's going to hurt Amazon's reputation, probably long after the fraudulent vendor is gone. I think the best examples I have so far are a cross-wise cut of real and "ersatz" 14GA where you can see how small the copper core is in the fake wire and a feather-out of the two wires stripped of about an inch of insulation. I think the weight suggestion from Stormie will work out well, too, since it provides an absolute metric as to the amount of copper per inch of wire.
Thanks for your input!
-- Bobby G.
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On Fri, 20 Jan 2012 14:01:58 -0500, "Robert Green"

A micrometer.....
But on the other hand, why are you worrying about it? It's just speaker wire, not some electrical wire that could start a fire if it was a little undersize. Seems like a lot of worry over nothing. Next time spend a few more bucks and buy some made in the USA wire. Not only will you get better materials, but help keep jobs in the USA.
And note, many things sold on Amazon and Ebay and similar sites are *seconds*. In other words cheap junk that does not meet standards. I will not buy any electronics, tools, car parts, computer parts, or appliances from these sites. Actually the only thing I've bought off any of these sites in the past ten years or so, have been books and movies. You're usually pretty safe buying books and dvds online. I learned my lessons the hard way back in the late 90's early 2000's buying ebay junk. A sawsall that was literally broke in half, including the metal shaft inside of it, and the package was not damaged at all. The seller refused to return it. A computer that went up in smoke due to bulging capacitors. I could have returned it, but the shipping would have cost more than the computer. I jsut saved the drives, cards, and memory and trashed the rest of it. Then there was the hard drive that was DOA, as well as a camera card that was DOA. And some memory that was mis labelled and refused to work. These days I go to a store to buy these things.
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On 1/22/2012 4:14 AM, snipped-for-privacy@myplace.com wrote:

Wow, some shady deals. I've purchased about 60 various things on ebay, most that could have been bad, and only got partially screwed once. One other time I had problems and they refunded my money without asking me to return the item, and the other time they sent me another new one without returning the bad one. Ya gotta watch their feedback score, less than 99.5% positive and you never know what you will get. Oh yes, one more time, a 230vac electric heater for the garage for $99. It had an overheated connection that broke off. I told the guy about it, and that I could fix it if he refunds me $40. He did so and I fixed the heater.
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wrote:

<stuff snipped>

Worse, still is that some real con artists know they can "buy" good feedback or at least use tricks to get it removed. I find you have to wade through a few pages of feedback to find those that have an unusual number of "feedback withdrawn" or canceled feedback listings. They are usually operating close to the edge, morally or legally.

I've had a similar experiences. I bought about 300 items all totaled before I gave up. Actually, PayPal wanted direct access to my account and I didn't like that - so it, too, was a factor in my leaving Ebay. I might return to sell off some of my excess junk before we move, but then again maybe not. Towards the end the quality of the merchandise in general was falling off and the participants were getting creepier and creepier.
Got a great deal on an outdoor PTZ dome camera for under $300 shipped from China faster than most vendors ship from California. Got great used CCTV stuff from Ebay, too, from vendors that buy huge auction lots. High end 16 ch $600 MUX's for $50 or less that worked perfectly. Other stuff, not so good but that's life.
I even bought a van through an Ebay listing although we consummated the deal off Ebay when no one reached his reserve. By that time I didn't think Ebay's buyer protection was worth much and I also lived nearby and could get to *see* the van. I researched about 400 wheelchair vans (even bought a CarFax subscription) and I can assure you that you should never buy a car sight unseen, especially without a road test.
Some of the scammiest, scummiest Ebay vendors I've ever run into were selling handicapped vans through Ebay motors. Aside from blatant lies about condition and past history, they usually managed to completely miss any damage when showing photographs. I traveled to Richmond (from DC) to inspect one van at a dealer and it was like that Star Trek pilot episode with the girl with the half-melted face. They only showed the unmelted side in the picture. The "minor cosmetic damage" they listed looked more like the gash that sank the Titanic.
It's just like anything else - buyer beware. While I'll chance the quality of a $24 coil of wire, I won't buy anything not guaranteed against DOA or expensive enough to hurt if it's a fraud.
Switching subjects, as a fan of the People's Court I was surprised to see this season not one, but two cases where someone bought a boat for way below "blue book" and then complained when weeks or months later, when they got it into the water, that it had problems after being out of the water for five years. Who would buy a boat without a water test? Or a car without a road test?
Another case was even stranger. A guy made a deal to buy a boat, and then got nervous when his mechanic discovered bad pressure in one of the cylinders. Buyer 1 then demanded that the seller allow him to pull the head and inspect the gasket. The seller immediately went to potential buyer number 2, willing to take the boat as is. Buyer 1 then sued the seller for reneging on a sale. What a world.
-- Bobby G.
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