A patio with a root problem

[Walter E.]

About 30 years ago, I planted a Japanese pine tree and and several Texas privets next to my concrete patio.

The Patio is about 50' by 15' in size. The concrete slab for the patio is 4" thick but does not appear to be reinforced. The builder merely cut grooves at 10 foot intervals.

I recently noticed that some concrete scallop borders near the patio had been uplifted.

When I tried to straighten out the concrete scallops, I found that roots from the pine had pushed them up about 4 inches. When I dug up the roots I found that the roots from the pine tree were about 3" in diameter and the roots from the privets were about 2 inches in diameter. I cut some of the roots where they disappeared under the patio concrete slab but I could not dig them all out.

What is the danger of these roots uplifting and breaking my patio slab? Should I cut down the pine tree and the privets?

[trader_4]

One big unknown factor is at 30 years how close to mature size are these things? And are you happy with them, really want to keep them? If they have a long way to go to mature size, then the risk is greater. If you like the tree/bushes, then one strategy would be to closely monitor it. At the first sign of cracking, then you have to deal with it. Almost all concrete has some cracks, so if you monitor it, catch it early, stop it, I would think the damage would be minimal. The real disasters where the concrete is totally broken up, pushed up, I think takes a long time with nothing done.

[bob haller]

plus mature trees have $$$$ value at home resale time. a older neighbor had a beautiful home with lots of trees. over a couple years he had every single tree cut down,

when he decided to sell the realtor who lives nearby remarked too bad john cut down all his trees, it probably cost him 20 grand.....

john claimed that during a storm a tree could hit his home. but most of what he cut down were far away from his home.......

my theory he wanted to end leaf clean up in fall, the trouble was all his neighbors tree leaves blew into his yard

[trader_4]

I have shade from large trees near my house. They were more even closer before I bought the place 20 years ago. I took those out to make the backyard a bit larger, but it's still nicely shaded. In summer with no AC on, my house will be 74, a friend with a new construction house, no trees, is 80+. It likely helps in winter to, by cutting down the wind. The downside is with more leaves, it's a pain.

[bob haller]

concete does not last forever, just a very long time

[Dan Espen]

Without seeing, hard to tell. Which do you like more, the tree or the patio? Eventually you will have to decide.

You might be able to remove part of the patio.

Trimming away the roots won't work long term, The tree will die or fall over (and die).

[clare]

Eventually they WILL lift the patio. Might not be in your lifetime - might be next year. People don't think when they plant trees too close to buildings or other manmade structures - like sidewalks etc - about how big those little twigs will get and what kind of root system it takes to support them.

When we bought our house there were 3 apple trees, a flowering quince,a cherry tree,a cedar hedge (about 18 or 20 cedars),3 maple trees, a spruce and a brace of cedars in one corner, and a huge pssy willow in the other, as well as a large lilac at the corner of the house. The Pussy willow was righnt next to what is now a large black spruce in the corner of the neigbours lot, which shares the small front yard with a large crimson king Maple.. Then there are 3 large maples on the boulevard beside the house and a large black locust on the boulevard in front. If I had not removed the cedar hedge, lilac and pussy willow long ago, the one maple on the back of the lot about the same time (after it froze and split several times), 2 of the apple trees, and last year the large cherry, I'd be living in a forest!!!! The cherry was only about 6 feet from the house and the trunk was a good 2 feet in diameter - and after chopping the top out 4 or 5 times it was higher than the top of our two story house again. There was no open sopace between the house and the boulevard maples - and even now the maple behind the deck in my back yard interwines with the boulevard maples,creating a pretty dense canopy.

So far no root problems (touch that whole pile of mixed firewood out back!!!)

[Sid in Sacramento]

you might try using small stump grinder and grind the roots along the outline of your patio, the fill the area with concrete to keep further penetration ( the trench has to be deep enought so that the roots would have to travel downwards, then up, to attack you patio JMHO