When we ordered our manufactured home, we ordered 200 amp service be built into it (cost extra, but many of you here recommended it so we went with it.) We also ordered 200 amp service from Edison, so when they finally get out there to install the electric, that's what they'll be giving us.
But...
Our contractor says, nope, the house is 100 amp and so he put a 100 amp pedestal next to the house for Edison to hook up to. He says maybe we ordered 200 amp service, but we didn't get it and we should ask for our money back on that.
How do we tell if we have 100 or 200 amp service? My husband has looked at the circuit breaker box on the back of the house and he says there's one larger switch at the top that is labeled 100, then all the smaller switches underneath it.
What happens if Edison puts 200 amp service on that 100 amp pedestal, and what if we do have a 100 amp house?
Or what if we tell Edison to only put 100 amp service on, but the house actually turns out to be 200 amp?
I'll be calling the dealership Monday for answers but I'm not hopeful. They don't seem to know their ass from a hole in the ground over there. I know what's on the spec sheet - 200 amp, but is that what they really put in the house?
Any advice or information would be greatly appreciated.
I'm not an expert, but i have owned residential and private property in the past. You don't mention if the installers did anything to your indoor wireing, to bring it up to a 200 amp? The smaller switches usually are 15, 20, 25 and 40 amps totally up to or just under 100. Now with 200 amp you should have more circuits adding up to just under or
200. Take a good look and add up all those circuits.
it sounds like your main panel is only rated for 100 amp maximum. so:
pay a different licensed master electrician with whom you would do business to perform a written inspection of your system from the pole thru the panel and all the way to your outlets, including service wire sizes, panel specifications, main and other breaker sizes, and outlets and other electrical items included in your contract and its blueprints; and estimate the cost to change the service to the 200 amp
220 volt service you ordered in writing including photographs. do not clutter this up with any addons unless you discover other things missing.
have a cup of coffee and decide how much money the difference is that you have been damaged.
pay your attorney to send a legal notice letter appropriate to your state or country to the seller of your new home requesting the compensation, and follow your attorney's advice.
Sounds like you got a 100 amp service. Make sure your electrician and electric company install wiring, meter base, etc. that has a 200 amp capacity. If you owe money for the home, don't pay until they come to install a 200 amp breaker panel.
Since this is band new install swapping this panel for 200A should not be that big of a deal. Wires to branches, breaker sizes, outlets, etc etc etc should be already to local code.
If electric company installs 200A meterbase, should be few hours project
Bring contract, ask dealer to make it right. After all small claims court would be an easy win for you.
The "house" is not 100 or 200 or any amps. that is determined by the capacity of the main wires coming in and the braker box in the house.
With a main breaker of 100A, the most you will be able to draw is 100A. Was the box put in by your electricain or the home builder? What size wire is feeding the panel? Could be the right panel, the right wiring, wrong breaker. I can't see anything so I don't know for sure.
Northing. It will only draw a maximum of 100A due to the 100A breaker.
You will be limited to the 100A unless you get (or have) a proper box and wiring.
Ya' got flim flammed. It happens with manufactured housing all of the time.
The 200 amp service pedestal is fine for use with what you have.
Nope, flim-flammed, ya'been had, ya' got the wool pulled over your eyes. Now go raise hell with the dealer that sold it to you and get some pay-back! The manufactured housing industry could be so much more. But things like your situation are just a small part of the problem. They will not improve until people stop putting up with them stealing your money and walking away without making things right. Read your contract carefully and get an attorney if necessary. I saw a $100,000.00 mobile home recently with the cabinet doors falling off. The rails and stiles in that home were made of 2x2s and 1/4" hardboard paneling. There's no excuse for that lack of quality.
Tom in KY, installed mobile home services for 12 years among other things.
Have the electrician set a 200a disconnect on the post and a 200a feeder to the house. (2/0 copper or 4/0 al) Your house is a sub panel. You can just add another one to the feeder if the load increases.
Of course your supplier owes you a refund or a new panel. If you do get the panel upgrade your post and service will already be OK for it.
200 A service was pretty standard where I live and when my house was build 30 years ago. My 200 A panel has a main switch that says 200. I wouldn't want an electric service less than 200A, more if I had any really heavy drawing tools.
that is what I have; actually the standard is higher now since my house is almost 30 years old.
The service amps have nothing to do with the breaker size below. The smaller breakers can total anything the box is rated for. Mine can handle a total of 18 breakers that in fact, could total 18 x 20A. Realistically, there is two 220V circuits, one 40A, on 30A, plus a couple of 20A and a bunch of 15A.
If you were to bring 200 A service to a building you may have one circuit for the lights, say a 15A and another for a few receptacles, a 20A. You have the ability to add more, but since it is a shed, you have only two, totaling a maximum of 25A, but you still have 200A service.
The number of circuits is determined by the needs of the building. In theory, you could put every light on its own circuit and every receptacle on its own too. That could bring the number of breakers over 100, but if the outside service is 60A or 100A and the main breaker is 60A or 100A, that is the rating of the service.
Most homes can still live comfortably with 100A for general appliances and non-electric fueled heat. All electric heat makes quite a difference. Even with oil heat and electric hot water, central air and an electric range, then you are pushing the limits.
Calm down a tad, call the builder first and ask for some one to come out and verify immediately. Then deal with the issues as needed.
On the cover of the electrical panel is all the information a person needs. You have two adults that says it 100 amps, I am guessing they read the panel information. This probably means that you have an 100 amp breaker panel installed.
Replacing the existing circuit breaker panel (100 to 200) at this stage is ridiculous and not going to give you anything. Get the cash back if indeed you paid extra for it. Normally if there is not a load to need such a panel they are not installed.
Installing a 200 amp pedestal and feeding the house with 100 is done every day. Some pedestals have room for more than one breaker so you could in theory have a spare 100 amps available for that shop or garage your hubby always wanted. The 200 amp pedestal costs some more to buy but everything else after that would be the same. Check with your electrician and ask if the 200 amp pedestal has room for more breakers. Then talk it over with the hubby
I am not ready to assume the worst about this company, but for the sake of argument, if what Square says is true, and it may be, I think the damages are not the difference in price between the 100A and the
200A service, that the seller charges.. (I was pretty sure someone told you that, but now I can't find any post that even discusses that part.)
Rather, the damages would, to the best of my knowledge IANAL, be what it costs you to get from where you are to 200Amps. It's going to cost more for an electrician to do it after the fact than it would have to do it at the factory. I don't know how much more.
I presume you have something in writing that says it will e 200Amps.
The seller is entitled to a reasonable time (although I don't know what that would be. A week or two? A month? I really don't know.) to agree to pay for the upgrade. Perhaps the seller is entitled to see an estimate or two, as with traffic accidents, I don't know.
But if they start to give you the run-around, answers that don't make sense, etc., I would consider and when I thought it would be effective, an action for fraud, and not just contract. I think you could still do this in small claims court, but you'd have to prepare pretty well. If you prove fraud, you may be able to receive punitive damages, which are not available in the usual contract case.
Fraud is an intentional misrepresentation of a significant? fact to your detriment., iirc.
I forget what word is used in place of significant, but they said it would be 200 and it's 100. That meets the requirement.
Intentionality is often hard to show, but if they don't try to put where you were supposed to be, with 200A, that is what you need to prove intention. Make notes during and immediately after all phone conversations. If they make promises, follow up conversations with letters to the person you talked to, with a copy to the vp of that division or someone like that. Letters in which you reiterate what you said but especially promises that they made. As far as what you said, write notes before you talk to them and then speak from your notes, checking off each point you've made as you make it, so that you know what you said, so that you won't make stupid admissions, like "it really won't matter if it is 100 or 200". While this is nonsense, of course it makes a difference, something like this might hurt you. Maybe "I'm not really sure we asked for 200". That will kill your case. Some people are embarrassed to ask for even what they've paid for and will even make false, self-deprecating statements to relieve their embarrassment or that of the person they are talking to. I'm not at all telling anyone to lie to enhance his case. I'm telling you NOT to lie to weaken your case.
That's why it's good to make notes in advance, accurate statements, and speak from your notes. Even if you were capable of speaking ad lib, it's hard to make full notes of what one says then. Have all or most of it pre-written, and then if you do say something in addition, you'll probably have time to write it down. How much if any of what you say should be in the letter, I don't know. IANAL and have no experience in this. Mostly you want the promises they made to fix it or pay for it inthe letter. If they made promises to pay something but not enough, that should be in the letter along with the reason it is not enough.
Some letters should be sent certified, return receipt, but I'm not sure which ones. All? Just the one where you recapitulate their promise to pay for repairs. Certainly if they don't promise, your demand letter with the electircians estimate. The more you think they are intentionally flim-flamming you, the more you should play hardball, while always being polite.
You want to be diligent about getting at least some of this done quickly. Most of the TV court shows are travesties of real court, but it is true, I think, that dawdling can look bad. Check out laches (pronounced. latcheez) on the net.
If it is legal in your state to record the phone conversations without telling them, I'd do that. Practice recordign off the phone in advance, to make sure the tape works, and that the suction microphone works if you have to use one of those. They worked perfectly with standard Bell phones, but probably don't with new phones with teeny speakers. If you can't record legally from your state, consider making the calls from an adjoining state if it is legal there. I think I would buy something and charge it on a charge card and save the receipt to prove that I was in the other state that day, and close to the time you made the phone call.
There used to be a requirement of an every 10-second beep, but I haven't heard about that for decades. Anyone know if that still applies at all?
A lawyer could help you, although the last time I hired a lawyer, 1000 dollars, I think he did a bad job and wouldn't even answer my questions. I'm still not done on that one. I got somewhat of a recommendation, but not enough.
Remove NOPSAM to email me. Please let me know if you have posted also.
I assume you have a Circuit Breaker box that came with the house. The panel rating is the size of the MAIN circuit breaker. There are two poles and you expect to see a two pole breaker rates for, duh, 100 or 200 amps. In times pay, each pole might be TWO breakers in parallel but I don't think anyone does that anymore.
That's the main difference between a 100 amp house and a 200 amp house. The second difference is that the feeder cable from the service connection of the panel has to be large enough to carry 200 amps.
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