Cost of concrete driveway

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Bob Morrison wrote:

Bob-
Agreed the "d" is really small but i think other factors are at work & the rebar wards them off......kinda like a rabbit's foot. :)
cheers Bob
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Bob Morrison wrote:

I would definitely include the subgrade and crack control joints. Except maybe for a home made concrete patio stone. :)

Thanks for the information. I appreciate the knowledge.
Carolyn
--
Carolyn Marenger


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AndyS wrote:

I'd say it was a bid from someone who really wanted the job & was proabably going to skimp on the details.
I would suggest writing up (or obtaining) at least some sort of simple specification for the prep, base, rebar (size & placement) & concrete (w/c ratio, strength) . Also some words about the finishing & quality of the result.
IMO 4" is was too thin & I'm not a huge fan of unreinforced thicker slabs.
I would go with #5" min with #4 @ 18" both ways ......I hate jagged, uneven cracked slabs.
I like them to crack in the control cuts :)
I'll probably catch some flak from the guys who don't like rebar in thin slabs (they insist it does no good)
My experience is that it holds the pieces together
You're getting ready to spend a fair chunk of $'s.........how do you want the result to look in a few years?
cheers Bob
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Bobk207 wrote:

3" is the current accepted minimum for concrete cover over/under rebar, right? That's a 6.5" slab. You're really good at spending this guy's money! ;)
I'm curious why he needs a 14' wide driveway. Maybe so two cars can pass? I'd go with a narrower driveway for the bulk of it and a couple bump outs* to allow passing. It'd be a lot cheaper.
R
* I got a laugh out of that one. Firefox's spell checker flagged bumpouts as incorrect, and gave me the choice of bump outs or bum pouts. Bum pouts?! Has anyone in the history of the English language ever combined bum and pouts??? Methinks not.
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RicodJour wrote:

I agree that 14' seemed a bit wide for a 300' driveway.....the house I sold last year had a 15' driveway but it was only 65' long....more of an extended parking area.
In this case maybe a narrower drive with "bum pouts" & an enlarged parking area....the material saved could go thicken the slab
I believe that cover requirements (& have had success with) are 3" for soil contact & 2" elsewhere. so that would be 5.5". Unless they've changed?
Yeah, I'll admit I'm good at spending money BUT it all depends on what the guy wants preformance wise. Is he going to be disappointed when the slab cracks (not in the cuts) AND shifts levels? And he's got cracked up mess
If not, go thin but otherwise the 5.5 to 6" ain't that much more material cost over the suggested 5" min. The extra concrete & rebar wiil add a few thousand $'s to the job & (IMO) greatly enhance the long term performance of the slab.
Soil condtions & weather could have major effects on the slab (I don't the local conditons in Eureka, TX) but in SoCal they're generally mild.
RIco did you get the post base photos, I sent last week?
cheers Bob
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In a previous post Bobk207 wrote...

Bob:
A minor correction to your calculation:
3" clear for the soil + #4 each way (= 2*5/8 OD) + 2" clear from top = 6-1/4". I would use a minimum slab thickness of 6-1/2"
And this assumes that no salt for de-icing is used on the driveway. If salt is to be used, then the top cover should be increased to at least 3 inches and even that is going to rust eventually. So, if salt is to be used then add the cost of epoxy coating the rebar to the cost of the project.
Boy, talk about spending other people's money! We sure can add it up fast. <grin>
--
Bob Morrison, PE, SE
R L Morrison Engineering Co
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Wide loads maybe?
Another option to cut costs, though it's a bit of an older look, would be to pour "strips" on each side of the driveway. Maybe 2 feet wide on each side. Vehicle tires usually don't run down the middle of the driveway, so you could save money by not filling the center with concrete. Pour the strips, and place gravel or grass in the center and on each side. You could always upgrade later and fill the center areas with concrete as time and money allows.
Just a thought...
Anthony
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In a previous post HerHusband wrote...

Anthony:
Good suggestion!
--
Bob Morrison, PE, SE
R L Morrison Engineering Co
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Bob Morrison wrote:

What the hell are you saying, Bob?! Anthony _sucks_ at spending other people's money. We're going to have to get the smoking jacket back and change the secret handshake again... ;)
When I lived in New Orleans about ten years ago, they upgraded Tchoupitoulas. Major truck route following the river. Obviously they have problems being on silty sand with an extremely high water table, so they couldn't prepare a BMOC (Bob Morrison Official Compacted) base. They designed the concrete road bed as a beam. The amount of concrete and rebar in that slab was astounding. I'd tease the guys working by pointing out that retaining walls were supposed to be _vertical_.
R
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Rico,

:) OK, well how about a 6" compacted gravel base, and a layer of concrete pavers? That's bound to cost more than just concreting the whole drive? It would look nice too...
Anthony
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HerHusband wrote:

Better. If you'd said a compacted base, concrete slab on top, some tumbled travertine pavers, and radiant snowmelting (bonus points if the driveway is in Florida) I'd forgive you and email you the new secret handshake instructions. It's a wee bit more complicated than the one you knew. It'll help if you're double-jointed. Take some pain meds while you're learning it. ;)
R
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I disagree. I've seen that done. The end result looks like a patched up mess. If you can't do it right, I suggest you just put down some gravel until you can do it right.
BTW, all driveways around here are 4" thick including mine and though it be 30 years old, is not broken up. #4 rebar 24" ew oc chaired on pour. Matter of fact, you won't find a crack in it. KC area.

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Bobk207 wrote:

No, Bob. I did delete my spam folder contents - I have my spam setting on Kill instead of Stun - but I reviewed it before deletion. Maybe I missed it. Please send it again. Thanks.
R
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At 14' wide, the concrete needs a saw joint down the center and cross cuts every 7 to 10 feet. There will be a lot of lineal expansion in 310', I would use expansion every 60'. The rebar is OK, but 4" is minimal. There should be a minimum of 1 1/2" cover on rebar, making 1/2" bar almost too big to cover with 4". Money is better spent on subsoil preparation and drainage.
$3 would be low in central Oklahoma, but our stone is all imported. ___________________________ Keep the whole world singing. . . . DanG

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Central Texas. Non union laborers. Suspect some were not documented non-native American workers. Small commercial company that normally does roadwork and such for commercial parking lots and slabs, and county roadwork.
Driveway is same 14' wide. 159' long. Also included adding a graduated entry from garage doorway tied to garage slab, personnel entry door landing tied to garage slab, a small sidewalk from that to the driveway some 10' long. 3/8 rebar every 12". No chairs. Beams on edge were 12" thick. 7" thick remainder. 3" of roadbase over stable Texas Hill country soil (gravel/rock/gray clay). Full apron at street tie-in. Apron drainage horizontally aligned with road frontage drainage, no culvert. Expansion joints every 10' made from #1 cedar 1X4s. All boundary edges were rounded. Included all flatwork. Surface is provided with purposely placed lines across the driveway for traction and drainage. Natural water course is across the driveway. Cost was a hair over 5K. The driveway was meant a roadway to the garage, not the house.
The remainder of driveway is strictly compacted roadbase, which forms a circle in front of the house. The center of the circle contains the septic tank. The septic boundary is in large rock surface man-made (me) formation. My sons compacted the roadbase with their loaded pickup trucks while it was wet last summer. Had to wet it down twice. They went over the course for over and hour. Had to get another load of roadbase as they mashed it down so well the first time. 3" PVC-UV under one area 5' from concrete driveway edge termination to allow drainage under straight roadbase area. Bermuda grass seems to like the roadbase, weeds don't. I'll get over it.
--
Jonny



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