leak in heat exchanger.

[Nigel Day]

Hi all,

my "ideal responce" boiler has developed a very slow leak where one of the water pipes enters the heat exchanger. The connection is not a hexagonal nut but a metal flange type fitting with two large screws and a allen key type nut on the side.

I tried to tighten these screws but they wont budge (any ideas?) or could i possibly add some type of heat resistant sealent around the fitting?

Is boiler finished along with my bank account (sniff sniff) or is there any way to repair this?

any help much appreciated.

nige.

[Stuart]

Hva you checked to see if anywhere has exploded diagrams of the various fittings to see how it is put together .perhaps Ideal's website .??

Adding heat resistant sealant might work but a better solution would be to try and get the fitting removed to see how it is sealed and repair it properly ... It might have a gasket or ceramic rope beneath the fitting .

Stuart

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[Fentoozler]

Is the leak definately from the connection? If so, drain down the boiler (whole system if open-vented), and re-make the connection (using appropriate o'rings / washers / PTFE etc) No gas connections involved. Beware, any water left in the heat exchanger which may escape once you undo the connection may be black as your hat. If the leak is infact from a split in the heat exchanger, then it is game over - not economically viable to repair.

A competent parts supplier (e.g. HRPC) will be able to help you identify any parts required, just supply them with the Gas Council Number (GC Number - found on the boiler data plate).

FYI - If you do manage to fix it, start saving again, as you PCB is likely to blow soon, possibly your fan will knacker up soon too - thats around £250/£300 + labour. These boilers are prone to these failures - get a Worcester or Vaillant.

Angus

[Nigel Day]

Thanks very much for your comprehensive replies, much appreciated. right about the pcb too. replaced it a few months ago:)

Are there any decent boilers these days that dont require multiple repairs after a few years of life?

thanks again

[Fentoozler]

As mentioned, Worcester Bosch (excellent boilers, excellent customer and technical support), or Vaillant. I am a Breakdown/Service Engineer, and all boilers of any make will break down one day, but in my experience of modern boilers (system,combi,condensing), there are some boilers you dread being called out to Alpha, Ariston, Biasi, Ideal - and some where you know you'll be able to diagnose the fault and get the manufacturer's support if required. Baxi are ok, also Glowworm (owned by Vaillant incidently).

Angus

[Fentoozler]

Actually Nige, for some reason, when I read your first post, a picture of a Potterton Suprema shot into my head, not an Ideal Response. An Ideal Response is a different kettle of fish. There are gas connections around the heat exchanger (don't touch the banjo tubes inside the boiler).

I have seen several leaks on Respose heat exchangers, and it is always a split (very often leaking directly into the fan which hangs off the bottom of the cylindrical heat exchanger, which can then cause explosive ignition). These are, in my opinion, nasty boilers, sealed pressurised system combi boilers. You will need to isolate the water to the boiler (the isolation valves will then probably leak once you've turned them), and drain off using the boiler's drain-off valve (difficult to get to and use)! Conversly, I can't remember replacing a faulty fan on a Response! I have replaced most other bits, temperature sensors, pcbs, low water pressure switches, flow switches, pressure relief valves, all bastards to get and and change.

I would get an engineer in if I were you, or save up and get a boiler replacement in the spring.

[andrewd909]

i have an ideal isar he35 and like the op it has a small leak where the return pipe enters the heat engine, it is also held in place by a plate secured by a small bolt/screw, the leak appears to be coming from one of the sump screws adjacent to the return pipe although the water may just be tracking to this screw. in your experience would the heat engine have failed?, its only 14 months old, or is it more likely to be a loose screw/ bad connectioin? i was tempted to try a proprietry brand of leak stopper, would this work, are there any problems associated with using leak stoppers?. i did phone ideal and explained that the boiler was just out of warranty and that the leak appeared to be quite old, however they 'only have enough engineers to cover warranty work', but if i have it repaired and send them evidence of a long standing fault they will consider bearing the cost

thanks

[Fentoozler]

This is a condensing boiler, and a nasty one at that. If not serviced properly (taking special care to clean out the condensate trap) then the condensate can sit in the heat exchanger / combustion chamber if there is a blockage and rot connections away - I've seen it happen, only on an Isar though, invalidating warrantys and being unrepairable in many cases. At 14 months old, you may still have a parts warranty left (up to 24 months possibly?), or they also offer a service call with a guaranteed fix unless related to sludge for £170 or there abouts.

Angus

[Stuart Noble]

Out of interest, what are these connections made from that water can "rot" so quickly?

[Fentoozler]

It must be over a year since I worked on one (thankfully). The example I saw was the 'spigot' at the bottom of the combustion chamber which then joined onto the condensate siphoning pipe work - this was a metal connection, steel or copper, which the highly acidic condensate will munch through (which is why condensate pipes are run in plastic). Design fault. Ideal again!

[Andrew Gabriel]

ISTR the Ideal condensing boilers used aluminium alloy heat exchangers back when I was selecting a condensing boiler. That was one of the reasons I avoided them. The water is slightly acidic (about same as vinegar).