The company I currently work for no longer require me and I, along with 799 of my co-workers, will shortly be shown the door. I'm thinking of re-training in Electrical Installation and would be grateful for advice as to which qualifications are needed - and which order to tackle them in. All replies appreciated.
The best route is probably to apprentice yourself to some large company already doing the type of work in which you are interested. If you are interested in setting up on your own as (say) a domestic electrician I'm afraid that's a lot more complicated since 1st January 2005.
The problem is Part P of the building regulations which means that most domestic work now requires building regulation approval; it must be notified and checked by the building control department of the council, their appointed representative or alternatively performed by a self-certifying electrician who then notifies BC.
Becoming self-certifying is no easy task though due to a dreadful bit of circular logic on the part of NICEIC (one of the six (I think) Approved Scheme operators); one of the requirements for joining NICEIC is that your company has to have been performing electrical installations for 12 months prior to your application, but it is difficult to do electrical work if you are not registered. If you have been working for 12 months but restricting yourself to "minor works" which often don't have to be notified then NICEIC will only register you for minor works and there doesn't appear to be a way to get fully registered unless you are willing to work for 12 months paying Building Control to come and inspect all your work. Other scheme operators (ECA, FENSA, NAPIT spring to mind) have similar requirements.
The other requirements seem quite easy by comparison:
Five hundred quid to register (about, operators vary).
C&G2381 or a direct equivalent is the minimum academic qualification. If you have no electrical background then other qualifications are recommended. Most local colleges of FE would be able to offer this course. If you are unemployed at the moment there is often a reduction in the fees.
You need copies of various publications, including the latest BS7671.
You need to be able to prove competence in knowledge of BS7671 (that's what the 2381 tries to prove), Electricity at Work Act and Building Regulations as they apply to electrical work.
You also need a full set of test equipment, traceable and calibrated and to know how to use it. C&G 2391 is the inspection and testing course, but it isn't essential. The equipment may cost upwards of £1,000 depending on which brand you buy, though a lot of cheaper kit is becoming available since I bought by stuff.
You need a Health and Safety policy, £2million public liability insurance and insurance in place to be able to offer a 24 month warrantee on all work.
And there's probably a lot more but I can't remember it right now.
Does this help?
Hwyl!
M.
Post here too Paul
Yes, that's a *very* informative forum to follow. For me, it's interesting to dip into, and my dips have led me to the conclusion that knowledgeable and competent electricians (a) exist, and (b) account for a minority of those posting at that forum. Few of the enquiries are at the 'dear Lord, you *cannot* be unsure of *that*, can you!? Tell me you're not Qualified and Practicing!", but quite a few are surprisingly naive.
Of course, it's hard to know how representative of the Trade the posters are - on the one hand, they're posting to clear up their own uncertainties, which is (a) a Good Thing, and (b) would account for an overrepresentation of the uncertain. On the other hand, it does make you wonder about all those who don't even *know* they don't know (shades of Mr Rumsfeld here!)
Stefek
surprisingly
That lines up with my experiences of domestic sparks. I always ask their advice on something basic out of curiosity, and mostly dont get the right answers. Theyre very sure of themselves though.
How representative my small sample is of the national population of sparks I dont know, but it sure says something about part pee.
NT
Heh heh. I work with sparks when filming. And they're all time served.
Just for a laugh, I asked about the new three phase colours. Not *one* knew out of about 10.
Years ago, I got railroaded into an interview board for employing staff sparks for studio work. Don't ask why. ;-)
Board consisted of one senior engineer, one personnel type, and me. A sound recordist.
The others waffled on about health and safety. I asked for a sketch of the schematic for a switch start fluorescent. One out of twenty managed it.
Yes - Thankyou. Indeed it does. For the sake of argument, consider that I have no prior experience (I have - just not formally qualified). Should I take the IEE 16th Edition Regs course (C&G2381) first, or the EAL Level2 VRQ for Domestic Electrical Installers first? The NICEIC site
OTOH the NICEIC site above seems to say that if I do just the IEE 16th Ed (C&G 2381) then I'd be qualified to join the Domestic Installer Scheme and could then go on to do C&G2391 and/or other NICEIC approved courses.
Any views?
Have you ever tried asking them how to wire up separate bits of kit (lighting and sound) onto a three phase socket ? Once found somebody who''d delta'ed the connections around the three phases (P1 - L1/N3, P2 - L2/N1, P3 - L3/N1). Fortunately he then noticed the unused terminal and decided to come and ask before he switched it on.
I would have thought it would be possible to do the two at the same time. Certainly when I did my 2381 it was an evening course, something like 12*3 hours spread over 3 or 4 months (Mondays so a couple of bank holidays hit that).
Yeah, you may be qualified, but unless there is some dodge I've not noticed the NICEIC aren't going to register you until you have been trading for 12 months. There was a rumour they were going to make it 6 months, but it's still 12 in the documentation I have. As I mentioned before this is a classic catch-22. Without registration you'll find it hard to get work. Without work you can't register.
Hwyl!
M.
Which bit of Marconi do you work for?
And did he get the job? :-)
David
The bit which *DOESN'T* manufacture any kit for the new BT 21CN contract - the bit that's being held out to dry 'cos they're moving all UK production offshore, because it's cheaper to sack UK employees than our European counterparts. The employment rights in Italy and Germany are such that they have jobs for life. Italy (where the BT 21CN product *IS* made) were offered
3 years salary AND 10,000 euros, not one took the offer up - so we get sacked instead!
served.
managed it.
shaking head here. Have added this lot to my part pee pre-faq.
NT
You're not going to like the answer. No. It went to the only female there. Who I suspect had been fast tracked through the usual weed out via the application forms - only about 10% get as far as a board. And there were a lot of 'ethnic minorities' in of the 20 too.
Before anyone starts, TV at that time had very few blacks or Asians in the 'craft' sections. Still, really, the same. So I'm well in favour of giving 'them' a good crack of the whip at interview time. But then I want it to be the best applicant who wins regardless - because I may have to rely on their skills.
However, she turned out to be a valuable addition to the studio team - very keen and helpful.
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