I have a customer with a small chalet with no electricity. I fitted
basic domestic alarm connected to a 75 ah leisure battery. What woul be best to trickle charge the battery wind or solar power. Also th charging device would have to be about 20-30 feet away from the chale because of tree cover. Any help much appreciated. Let me know if yo need more info
-- Alec
Based on observed practice, I'd suggest wind. I've noticed a large number of Rutland (type) wind chargers on boats I see on a regular walk I do. Even this morning I noticed one that was spinning two quick to count the blades but the wind was imperceptible. It was very compact, blades turning diameter probably only 15" or so.
May be worth dipping into the rec.boat.electronics newsgroup, the application is similar.
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73 Brian| |I have a customer with a small chalet with no electricity. I fitted a |basic domestic alarm connected to a 75 ah leisure battery. What would |be best to trickle charge the battery wind or solar power. Also the |charging device would have to be about 20-30 feet away from the chalet |because of tree cover. Any help much appreciated. Let me know if you |need more info.
This FAQ is about caravanning, but describes all the methods I know about.
You can caravan without that orange cable FAQ
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This FAQ is intended to give some pointers on how to caravan without that orange cable, or at a site where hookups are not available. It does not try to say what is best, because that will depend on your individual circumstances, but does try to give basic information about the methods and the advantages and disadvantages of each alternative.
For general information on batteries see:
Domestic multimeters now cost as little as ?2.50 and are useful for caravan work.
A new fully charged 110Ah Leisure Battery will last most people for a weekend, but very few a week. For longer than a few days you will have to recharge the battery somehow. Remember that as batteries get older and as they have more use/misuse they will hold less charge, and eventually need replacing.
Leisure batteries are usually *not* the no maintenance batteries becoming common in cars. If yours allows topping up, always check your electrolyte, and top up to marks on the body with distilled/deionized water regularly. You should always charge your battery(s) before you leave home, either on the bench, or by leaving the van powered up, you should give either method several days to fully charge. Cheap chargers make gas, so you must top up the electrolyte. Expensive electronic chargers do not fully charge the battery, and make less gas so need topping up less frequently. Remember also that the electrolyte will evaporate slowly even while the battery is unused.
There is very little power in a leisure battery so you should use it as sparingly as practicable. You should use LPG for as many things as possible. You should also make sure that the your electric appliances will run off 12 Volts. High power electrical equipment is bad news. A
1000 watt heater used on its own, will run for less than 1 1/2 hours, 500 watts less than 3 hours. 250 watts some 5 hours. As a general rule something like a TV taking 50W or 4 amps for a few hours per day is the heaviest load practicable.The output voltage of a battery falls slowly as a charge is used, and eventually the 12 V equipment will stop working. TVs etc. need as many volts as possible. Thin long wires which may be supplied by the van manufacturer or as a D.I.Y. addition, may have a high voltage drop. If possible add extra wiring for TV, or other electronic equipment, of thick wires ?2 sq mm? or preferably more, and as short runs as practicable.
You should find out how much charge you use on an average day in the van. The maths is simple 110AH=1320wattHours. watts=12*amps, amps=watts/12, at 12 V DC. Find how many watts/amps each appliance uses from labels or instructions. Multiply these by the hours each is used daily. Add daily charge used in watthours or amperehours used by each of your appliances together to give daily charge used. You should replace this charge averaged over 2-3 days. There are many alternative ways of replacing this charge, the choice is yours, and will depend on your personal circumstances. Beware especially of red "standby" LEDs, the circuit behind them uses about 7 watts, which is a tiny amount of power, but they are on 24 hrs, less the hours they are used, per day. Allow 12 ampere hours or 144 watthours *each* per day, which is a significant drain on the battery.
Car
For this application, where all you are replacing is the self- discharge of the battery plus a bit for the electronics, you may find one of the smaller solar panels are fine, even in Winter. They're maintenance-free and less likely to attract undesirables in isolated locations. I've got one of those "in-car" dashboard types that is fine for maintaining a battery against it's self-discharge, plus a few mA for an electronic circuit. See:
The wind chargers on boats that are running fast in light winds are doing nothing (except making a noise...). When the battery is charged, the power output required is small so there is little braking effect on the fan. The more load (=charging current) that is required, the slower the fan turns. Some of the ones with better regulators apply a short to the output when charging isn't required which is the equivalent of applying a brake to the generator, to reduce the mechanical wear. The larger ones will turn the tail so the fan is not in the best wind direction.
| |I have a customer with a small chalet with no electricity. I fitted a |basic domestic alarm connected to a 75 ah leisure battery. What would |be best to trickle charge the battery wind or solar power. Also the |charging device would have to be about 20-30 feet away from the chalet |because of tree cover. Any help much appreciated. Let me know if you |need more info.
Not what you asked, but it strikes me that if your customer is paying for a leisure battery, plus charging system, they will have enough charge in the battery to run a few 12V lights, a water pump and all the usual things you can find in a caravan, including a 12V TV. They would need at least 2 amps from the trickle charger to do that.
I have a slightly larger installation at my farm, with 800AH of battery, however I started with 100AH of battery so I've been through what you are trying to do. The short answer is that you need both and a charge controller. For what you are looking to do one of the Rutland charge controllers will fit the bill. They have two inputs, solar and wind and will dump the current from the wind generator to a diversion load when the battery is fully charged.
I would suggest that you start with a solar panel, and then add a wind gneerator if necessary. However I also work on eletrical/electronic installations on motorways and if you look you will see that for low current drain stuff we use solar only, for higher drain uses we have both wind and solar.
You'll forgive, I am sure my tetchiness at tradesmen who take on a job that they are unqualified to do and then come to a diy group to find out how to do it.
|I would suggest that you start with a solar panel, and then add a wind |gneerator if necessary. However I also work on eletrical/electronic |installations on motorways and if you look you will see that for low |current drain stuff we use solar only, for higher drain uses we have both |wind and solar.
What are those green boxes which you see beside motorways, with a solar panel on the top?
Why so large?
|In article , | Alec wrote: |> I have a customer with a small chalet with no electricity. I fitted a |> basic domestic alarm connected to a 75 ah leisure battery. | |Why so large?
That is the *small* one. Caravanners usually have 110ah
They are traffic counting devices. The box is linked to a set of loops buried in the road surface one pair of loops in each lane. You can usually see the loops as a shiny outline on the road surface. The green box counts traffic flow and sends the data back to the National Traffic Control Centre. NTCC use the data to work out where there are serious delays and then set messages on the EMS signs to divert traffic around the problem.
You can realistically only draw around 35% of total capacity, so it's functionally a 25AH battery. It's probably oversized, I would guess that the actual requirement is closer to 8-10AH, but at least it will give some headroom for a couple of days power outage.
Thanks for all the replies. I will definitely look into the rutlan equipment and let my customer know. I have also had some luck with m local supplier (after I had posted) who also recommended solar firs and wind as a backup if needed. Thanks guys much appreciate
-- Alec
We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember Steve Firth saying something like:
Everybody's got to start somewhere with this kind of thing. You had to, yourself.
|On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 14:32:24 +0100, Dave Fawthrop wrote: | |> On Sat, 17 Jun 2006 14:02:46 +0100, Steve Firth |> wrote: |> |>|I would suggest that you start with a solar panel, and then add a wind |>|gneerator if necessary. However I also work on eletrical/electronic |>|installations on motorways and if you look you will see that for low |>|current drain stuff we use solar only, for higher drain uses we have both |>|wind and solar. |> |> What are those green boxes which you see beside motorways, with a solar |> panel on the top? | |They are traffic counting devices. The box is linked to a set of loops |buried in the road surface one pair of loops in each lane. You can usually |see the loops as a shiny outline on the road surface. The green box counts |traffic flow and sends the data back to the National Traffic Control |Centre. NTCC use the data to work out where there are serious delays and |then set messages on the EMS signs to divert traffic around the problem.
Thanks!
Umm yes, but I'm not selling my services, to others. I'm a DIY loon having fun at my own expense.
It's a Newsgroup, not a Site.
No it isn't it's a Newsgroup.
Owain
Thats what the customer has to be honest no other reason. But everytim I do a load test it only registers about 40-50ah. Even after a ful charge
-- Alec
How many offline power systems have you installed?
Your post indicates this is the first, hence you are unqualified in this respect.
Fuck me are you going to join Drivel in the stupid bin?
I hadn't even noticed your tetchiness to be honest and as a NACOSS Gol (now NSI) approved engineer in all aspects of CCTV, Access control an Intruder alarms for 16 years who are you to say I'm unqualified. Als this is the first job in said 16 years where I haven't had a 240va supply and also a customer who only visits the site once every months over winter hence the need to keep the battery in good nick. Al other battery powered jobs have had some sort of charging system. I' not selling my services it's an idea thought up by myself and m customer. Ultimately he will end up fitting it with his son. We wer looking for feedback and ideas but I hadn't expected judgemental peopl like you on whats normally a friendly site. Remember it's DIY Banter.
-- Alec
On Mon, 19 Jun 2006 00:28:27 +0100, Alec wrote: |I haven't had a 240vac |supply and also a customer who only visits the site once every 2 |months over winter hence the need to keep the battery in good nick.
Leisure batteries (when not maintenance free) require topping up at intervals. Insist that your customer tops up the battery at regular intervals. 2 monthly should be fine, if you install some sort of charge controller.
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