CH pump efficiency & savings

[Andrew Gabriel]

It's across the board. It's what now drives things like the IEE Wiring Regs (lots of companies trying to force their products to become mandatory), banning light bulbs of various types, specifically those which the EU manufacturers regard as cheap imports undercutting their high margin products, etc. updates to building regs, etc.

None of this is based on what it should be based on - risk analysis and impact assessments, and energy saving versus costs in the light of viable newer technologies.

The heating pump industry managed to jump on the bandwaggon, and also showed how thick and easily mislead our legislators are.

We just pay for it all, of course.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

I'd say it could be down to the disdain the establishment have for 'engineering' of almost any sort. Hence this country being biased so heavily in favour of 'services' rather than actually making things. I'm not knocking services - but have long felt a better balance is needed.

[Tim Streater]

[harryagain]

It may make sense in the future as the cost of electricity rises.

[Andrew Gabriel]

No - it's due to the establishment (government) pulling out of the processes so they don't have to pay for any of it. They see it as a big win that industry now pays for it all, and so does industry ;-)

I think that's unrelated.

[Robin]

IMHO that hits the nail firmly hit on the head.

Simple example:

a. building regulations can be downloaded free from

with the cost of producing them met from taxes and counted as public expenditure; but

b. British Standards (which are increasingly de facto law) are hived off to the BSI which meets its costs by charging a packet - eg ~65 for BS 7671.

[Dave Plowman (News)]

Think it was more the case of BSI being 'hived off'. Although I see nothing wrong in a business being charged for accreditation of a product.

[Andy Burns]

BS 7671 is excluded from the bundle of online standards available via most libraries

"Only available for download as part of the Wiring Regulations Subscription or as a free of charge download from the BSI Shop"

Of course I can't find any such free download, it's £85 for the 2008 document including the 2011 amendment plus an extra £5 for the 2013 amendment.

[John Williamson]

The £65 quoted is just to buy a copy of the document, not to get something certified as complying. That's *much* more expensive.

If your library subscribes, or you join Manchester Library, you can read any British Standard for free, though.

[Andy Burns]

Unfortunately not *all* of them.

[Tony Bryer]

Rip-off pricing IMO. I recently had to buy an updated copy of Eurocode 5 (timber) + National Annex which fixes some issues in the original. Price £324. In earlier times the changes (there weren't many) would have been listed on a (say) 8 page amendment costing a nominal amount.

[polygonum]

It is quite arguable that people who need full access should pay. But as ordinary citizens we should be able to see an overview - half the time products claim BS whatever and we don't know if that is the packaging, electrical safety, crash resistance, colour matching or any other technical feature!

We usually do not need to know the processes by which testing must be carried out, etc., but do need to know that the 13A plug conforms to the BS for 13A plugs (safety, fit, etc.) rather than the its packaging will protect it in transit or some other non-relevant issue.

[John Stumbles]

When it rises by an order of magnitude one might make the claimed savings.