What's the {..} deal w/ steel shingles?

[<h>]

No matter how you use your credit card (direct, PayPal, etc.), you&#39;re covered. I&#39;m a merchant, and believe me, the credit card company sucks the money out of the merchant&#39;s account (chargeback) the moment a complaint is filed. Then it&#39;s the merchant&#39;s responsibility to prove the sale is valid and have the chargeback reversed. Merchant must show proof of delivery, signature from an in-person sale, etc. to get the money back. As I tell all my customers who are new to online buying, "Use your card and you&#39;re 100% covered".

That said, your seller only guarantees $200 by PayPal and only offers "merchandise credit" not a refund, so you might want to do some more checking. Also, a very small number of transactions/feedback for 3 years as a user. Has this person sold this type of item in the recent past? Check the feedback and contact previous customers and see if the seller is legit.

[Frugal Farmer]

Jim, thank you - first person that can see what I see. and this group sports almost 6000 registered, savvy, DIYers.

did check back in August = $200

thank you, I might be a dumb farmer but not dumb enough to part w/ $10K just like that....

it&#39;s a great thing and looks great. my advice so far: use the list of mfgs I posted at the beginning of this thread as your starting point. dont let the door-to-door shysters tell you it will cost you $600-$1400 SQ (installed). One weekend, two people, the roof is up. Same cost as asphalt shingles, except these last 50+ yrs and look better. this is the vortex vacuum cleaner all over again. and there&#39;ll be suckers like &#39;coffee&#39; that posted here earlier that will think the going price is $900/SQ. it&#39;s not. the mfgs sell 1SQ for $100/SQ (approx.). to wholesalers. a # of folks (farmers) here got duped already...

[Caesar Romano]

You would be insane to pay this in advance.

[Frugal Farmer]

- I&#39;ll have to change banks or get another CC. I discussed this ebay (shingles) transactions w/ them and was told I was on my own if charged via paypal. anyway, the seller doesnt accept CC unless it is processed via paypal and then paypal covers only $200. Shingles are useless unless accompanied by matching accessories.

the seller is legit. I talked to Tamko sales dept. in Aug. and he is registered as a reseller in good standing - no complaints. That was his main theme when I refused to wire funds. the more he insisted on how good he is and how he needs to protect himself from unscrupulous customers the more I knew something&#39;s wrong w/ that deal. also, his company, CCA inc doesnt accept credit cards to keep their costs down - go figure...

[Jeff]

As someone who is looking at requiring a new roof soon, I was curious about the original question being asked.

I don&#39;t intend to do my own roof. I have more than enough home-repairs and renovations, that I don&#39;t think I&#39;ll kill myself doing , to last me the next few years. So the gist (jist?) of the original post, How much more than a standard shingle roof is reasonable to spend on a metal or other "life-time" type roof. Our nieghbour across the street had one installed in one day. I didn&#39;t realize it was a metal roof going up or I would have paid more attention. I beleive they went over the old shingles, saving a heck of a lot of time (labour) and the cost of bin and disposal. To my mind that should help balance out higher material costs.

[dpb]

Jeff wrote: ...

I would say that is, in all likelihood, false economy. To invest in the "high-priced spread" for the purpose of a long lifespan and then to cut corners on the installation is at complete odds with each other...

[Harry K]

Try a real building supply business. I have never had a problem ordering non-stocked items through one.

Harry K

[Harry K]

Try dealing with a real building supply store. I have never had any problem ordering things they don&#39;t normally keep in stock.

Harry K

[Frugal Farmer]

I didnt speak w/ anyone. I sent an email to Reinke (address listed on their contact page) re DIY price/shipping sometime back in August. My email was forwarded to a dealer/installer in WA responsible for my area. I didnt follow up after that as I presumed his price will include installation as well.

I would have thought aluminum shingles were a lot more expensive than $190/SQ.

this is good to know. and not just for me.....

Incidentally, even though this thread re steel shingles is only a few days old, it was already noticed by a mfg ( custom-built metals) who contacted me via email (above) w/ an offer to sell directly if my area is not covered by their distributor. They will sell directly, shingles and trims, at the price the installer gets it from wholesalers. Their "retail" price is $169/SQ. btw, this is the same price that the installer then turns into $900+/SQ (installed) - an "honest price" according to user "coffee" that posted here earlier. I have the complete price list (shingles/trims) and can make it available to whomever needs it. Perhaps it would make sense to keep this thread open should there be other mfgs that will sell directly to DIY homeowners so we can take advantage of this information and "shop around".

I dont know what the advantage of aluminum over steel is. however, my goal is to get new roof at the same price or lower than asphalt shingles would cost me. DIY steel shingle roof @130/SQ will cost less than asphalt shingles roof (installed) and last 50+ yrs maintenance free, many with lifetime warranty.

[Jim Elbrecht]

How is installing a roof over a single layer of shingles &#39;cutting corners"? Especially a metal roof. From the OP&#39;s post it sounds like this may have been a conventional metal roof- not metal shingles, which may have different demands.

But, even in general, I thought it was fairly common practice, as long as the original roof was lying flat, to install a second layer of roofing over the first.

Jim

[dpb]

"Common practice" isn&#39;t the same as "best practice" and particularly when using a high-end product, anything that isn&#39;t consonant with that just doesn&#39;t make sense.

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[dpb]

So you blew off the response on an assumption and complain of some perceived disinterest in selling to DIY&#39;ers when the vendor provided you a contact for your region which is apparently halfway across the country so you wouldn&#39;t have to pay single-load shipping costs.

The primary advantage of Al over steel is weight. Whether it&#39;s a significant advantage for you is a choice/decision only you can make.

To expect to get a lifetime or 50+ warranty and metal shingle roof for less than asphalt shingle may be dreaming based on pricing I did when looking in on what to do w/ the old barn. There&#39;s a point at which "frugal" becomes "cheap".

FWIW, which ain&#39;t necessarily much, in the end, I chose to go back to wood for two reasons -- the primary being in keeping w/ the original look of a large old barn which is, to the best of my knowledge, the last of only two still in the county, and secondarily, cost. Towards the end of the season after a devastating hail early that spring the local builder had what was perceived as an overstock left and not enough warehouse space to store them inside over winter, so let me have the 70 sq at $95 per...

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[Frugal Farmer]

yes, I did. my mistake. at first I presumed the cost of plain aluminum shingles as opposed to special steel, painted, shingles would be lower or comparable. classicmetalroofingsystems dealer wrote that aluminum is generally more expensive than steel. my budget for this reroofing job is $10K which corresponds to $130/SQ shingles, prorated trim & $1200 freight. it was in large part a fin. decision not to pursue this avenue.

Tamko shingles are average at best, yet w/ 50 yr warranty.

yes, cheap as in price. not cheap as in quality. frugal as how far a dollar spent will go. My options are: a) local roofer replacing asphalt shingles for $10K, guaranteed for 20 yrs w/ declining value. b) DIY steel shingles for $10K, guaranteed for 50yrs (at least) & maintaining value; in fact increasing the resell-value of my house.

[Richard J Kinch]

Lifetime? Bunk.

If steel lasted a "lifetime", the third world would be adorned with immaculate tin roofs.

No warranty with a contractor is worth anything a few years out.

[Frugal Farmer]

here&#39;s a link to lifetime warranties:

a simple search "steel shingles" "lifetime warranty" will generate dozens upon dozens of qualified hits

[Richard J Kinch]

So you believe galvanized steel is going to last a lifetime?

[salty]

Umm... Many roofing materials will last a lifetime. A slate roof can last 80-100 years. At that point, you may have to pull it all off and then nail the same slate back up with new nails and flashing for the next 80-100 years of service.

[Frugal Farmer]

Jeff, any chance finding out more details re the new steel roof in your state/region? i.e. type of shingles (tile, shake, slate,..), installer, manufacturer, total roof sq. ft., total cost?

[Richard J Kinch]

Copper and slate, yes.

Galvanized steel, no. This "lifetime roof" is the latest bunko sales swindle, a la "liquid siding". Cheap old stuff sold as something new because it comes with a (worthless) faux-warranty.

[Frugal Farmer]

those with all-brick or all-stone houses that will last 100&#39;s yrs will install copper or slate shingles. the rest of us, the way average N.A. houses are built these days, will settle for the lifetime that&#39;s 50-70yrs long. beats asphalt shingles.

agreed. yet, most of these steel shingles, especially after first reroofing, will go down w/ the av. house.

sure. most mfg/installers probably cannot see themselves in business past 20 yrs or being under the same ownership.

Hypothetically speaking, given the current steel shingle market conditions, what are the barriers to entry for, let&#39;s say a proprietor w/ low overhead costs selling steel online, to add steel shingles to his "repertoire", by-passing installers and retailing directly to DIYers?

Not as much manufacturers as distributors of steel shingles (just as torsion springs mfgs for garage doors) believe they are better off not retailing their product directly to the public. They believe they are maintaining higher prices for their product by restricting sales "to the trade." In other words, "We do not sell to the end user. We protect our dealers," which would seem to be prima facie evidence of an illegal restraint-of-trade scheme. But this is an old story which is true of virtually every product and service, going back to medieval guilds and before. (note: this quoted without permission)