My toilet has been plugging up a lot recently. I do not think it is the trap in the toilet because when I put a toilet auger down the toilet, it did not hit the clog until it was about 26 inches down.
Is there a SeeSnake type inspection camera that is flexible enough to go through a toilet trap? Is there anything else I can do to identify the problem? Thank you in advance for all replies.
My toilet's innards began malfunctioning a while back, which meant that the tank filled up with less water than before. It was just enough of a difference to make it flush badly and clog more often. After using a working toilet for long enough, you should have some sense of whether the flush cycle seems normal. Does it?
Pulling and reinstalling a toilet is typically an easy job. One water connection and 2 bolts to remove, some clean up of the old wax ring and the "sticking on" of a new one prior to bolting the bowl back down.
Assuming it's your first time, In and Out shouldn't take more than an hour, not including putting your tools away afterwards, and that's working really slow.
Granted, you could run into issues with the shoe or something else, but that's pretty rare.
Once the toilet is off, you can use a bigger snake or a camera or maybe even a flashlight, depending on your configuration and the location of the clog.
Keep this in mind:
The "clog' you think you hit might not even be the clog. There's lots of tales in this NG about snakes going right past the problem, such as the time I had a toilet paper roll stuck in the bottom of the toilet. Liquids and some solids would pass through it - as would the snake - but it often clogged when paper caught the rim of the roll. I didn't find the problem until I pulled the toilet and look into the bottom.
I still keep a spare wax ring in the shop just in case I need to pull a toilet in an "emergency". Once you've done it, you'll see how easy it is.
Tip: They usually suggest a sponge or towel to soak up the remaining water in the tank or bowl, but I always use my shop vac with a small diameter hose. That gets it almost bone dry.
Good luck!
Pulling and reinstalling a toilet is typically an easy job. One water connection and 2 bolts to remove, some clean up of the old wax ring and the "sticking on" of a new one prior to bolting the bowl back down.
Assuming it's your first time, In and Out shouldn't take more than an hour, not including putting your tools away afterwards, and that's working really slow.
Granted, you could run into issues with the shoe or something else, but that's pretty rare.
Once the toilet is off, you can use a bigger snake or a camera or maybe even a flashlight, depending on your configuration and the location of the clog.
Keep this in mind:
The "clog' you think you hit might not even be the clog. There's lots of tales in this NG about snakes going right past the problem, such as the time I had a toilet paper roll stuck in the bottom of the toilet. Liquids and some solids would pass through it - as would the snake - but it often clogged when paper caught the rim of the roll. I didn't find the problem until I pulled the toilet and look into the bottom.
I still keep a spare wax ring in the shop just in case I need to pull a toilet in an "emergency". Once you've done it, you'll see how easy it is.
Tip: They usually suggest a sponge or towel to soak up the remaining water in the tank or bowl, but I always use my shop vac with a small diameter hose. That gets it almost bone dry.
Good luck!
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I think he should flush some fresh crabs down the toilet to chew through whatever's there.
Sounds like a problem I had, toilet would work OK 3 times out of 4 ran the snake through it numerous times couldnt find anything, Finally bit the bullet and pulled it apart and there was a pencil to long to make the turn in the pipe. Must have been just the right length that it could make it through the trap and not the turn in the plumbing.
Jimmie
Before you do anything removing the toilet, make sure the siphon jet isn't plugged up with scale. That's the hole under water on the front of the bowl. I just posted about my experience with that, which was similar to yours. A weak vortex is an indicator, but the problem develops slowly enough that you might notice the vortex is weak.
Couple of points. Depending on age of toilet and plumbing hardware, you're better being prepared to replace the stop and line to the tank. The tank should be removed first, so that's 2 more bolts that might be too rusty to re-use. Always do this kind of stuff either having the parts, or when you can go get them at the hardware store.
--Vic
re: "The tank should be removed first"
First? Why would you remove the tank at all?
Someone must have sneezed out a tampon, it went down the drain and swelled up.
re: "The tank should be removed first"
First? Why would you remove the tank at all? ============
So you can clean behind it for the first time in 27 years.
I admit this question surprises me. Sort of like asking why first remove the TV from the TV stand when you're going to flip it over to fix a leg. But maybe others do it that way. I've pulled and/or replaced maybe 15-20 toilets, none real modern. Had a job with a plumber for a while, and do my own plumbing.
The tank was always about half the weight of the toilet, that's one reason. The tanks doubled the height of the toilet, and increased the depth by about 25%. Most were in a fairly tight space next to a vanity, so moving them out is easier in 2 pieces, that's another reason.
The first one I ever put in, I put the tank on before putting the bowl on the stack. When moving it in the tank wiggled on the washer and I heard a slight crackling of ceramic. I stopped right there and took the tank back off to check it. It was okay. But I never did that again. Never broke a tank. That's the big reason.
Do you really flip a toilet over with the tank on? All the more power to you. I have no experience with "modern" toilets. Let's say post-1995.
--Vic
"JoeSpareBedroom" wrote in news:XSuko.5214$ snipped-for-privacy@newsfe08.iad:
It can be an easy job or it could be bad. I've seen the closet ring/bolts crash and burn as soon as you move them. But then again, actually a good thing to get it before it starts leaking just enough to rot the subfloor but not be noticed by eye.
My story is intermittent poor flush. Did the auger thing. Pulled the toilet. Ran hose in top and bottom directions. Nothing. Then just happened to move it right and out comes a toothbrush. SWMBO dumped dirty bucket of water down the toilet. Cleaning brush not visable.
Oh well. Shit happens.
Vic Smith wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
And it makes the toilet WAY rear-heavy and difficult to balance when you're muscling it around by yourself. It's a good way to induce dislodgement of the wax ring while setting the toilet in place. Myself, I pull the tank.
Some shit is worse than other shit. I have a Tramco lift system in my house.
*Everything* goes through the pump. After almost 50 years the pump started to fail. Worked fine the 12 years I'd been in the house. It was a PITA to find a good plumber to do the job but I found one and $2100 later I had a new pump in. A couple weeks later the pump starts vibrating. Figured it was a defect. Get the guy back and he says he's never had an install fail. He had to pull the pump out of the tank. Ladies panties all wound up in the impeller. I have my suspicion about how that happened, but a suspicion is only that. I did momentarily think about posting a sign in the bathroom saying, VISITORS: If you shit your panties DON'T flush them down the toilet!Anyway another $290 fixed me up, and believe me, I got off cheap. It's good when your plumber is a former seminarian.
--Vic
Well, I guess space has never been issue, but every toilet I've ever pulled and reinstalled, I've done with the tank on.
I face teh tank, straddle the seat and grab the toilet just behind the seat bolts and lift. That method keeps the toilet balanced and moves it up or down the bolts in a straight path. I then waddle my way around to wherever I need to take the toilet.
And yes, I've flipped - well, laid on its side - many a toilet with the tank on. I'm always gentle and I usually lay towels or cardboard on the floor. I've never had a problem and I don't think I could count how many I've done.
The only time I've installed them in 2 pieces is for a new install.
To be sure, I've never carried one this way:
I've only done 4 or 5 toilets, but I can't imagine leaving the tank on unless you have a huge room with amazing amounts of space to move around in. All the bathrooms I've ever worked in were not big enough to lay the toilet over on its side and still have room to work comfortably.
:
How much time are you spending under your toilets?
Best case is you're cleaning some wax ring residue, worst case you're removing whatever is clogging it.
You know, you *can* lay it down right where it used to be standing.
Besides, who's trying to get "comfortable" while cleaning a toilet?
And then there's the option of moving it to another room, which is what I did when I removed my mom's so they could lay new linoleum.
When I consider the option of trying to remove the rusted bolts from inside the tank vs. moving the toilet as one piece, I'll opt for the one piece every time.
Maybe that's why I'm so quick to suggest pulling the toilet when trying to find a clog. It's a really simple job - if you don't remove the tank.
te:
My concern is the stress that you put on the tank and tank bolts when the tank is not in its normal position over the bowl.
rote:
I can understand your concern, but I can only speak from experience.
The only time I have ever cracked a toilet is when the back swing of a sledge hammer hit the rim.
While doing a bathroom remodel I was torn between keeping the old toliet and replacing it. An errant swing of the sledge made that decision fairly easy.
If you saw my current bathroom you wouldn't say that. There's maybe 18" floor inches to the tub, the same to the vanity, and maybe 3' to the facing wall.
Sure, a contortionist could move the toilet out of the way right there to get at the stack, but why? And I could lift the whole thing up and carry it out with some careful maneuvering, dripping whatever on the hallway carpeting on the way to, where, the kitchen? But again, why? If I have a go at mine for any reason I'll pull the tank, lay it in on a rag in the tub in 3 seconds and not worry about a clumsy assembly. Probably put the bowl next to it so I could clean the floor good.
Removing the tank is standard practice for me and was for the plumber I worked for. Both of us were very strong, BTW. The circa 1930-40' Chicago apartment building baths I worked on with him had similar sized bathrooms to mine. Mine is 12' x 4' 10". I looked at some "professional" plumber forums to see what I was missing and found that some never remove the tank. Seems their reasoning is saving time on a paid job or they don't want to deal with corroded tank bolts.
Doesn't change my mind at all. I also do automotive work and have seen plenty of "professional" mechanics do work differently than I would. And I've had furniture and appliances delivered by "professional" movers and was surprised to see one guy get of the truck. Usually he was up to it but mostly I've had to help to prevent my door trim and walls from getting banged up.
Me! I like my work area clear of unnecessary clutter.
I think that's the big bugaboo. Only reason I can think of. It's takes me maybe 5 minutes to remove tank bolts. Maybe 10 minutes once. Wide screwdriver and wrench/channel locks/visegrips. If it's frozen a hacksaw blade gets through quick. They're soft brass. I've never removed a bowl due to clogging, just for a new toilet or ring replacement. Every time R&Ring the tank internals was also due. If I was a plumber and pulled an old toilet for ring or clog, I might sell the client new tank internals. They're cheap enough. If he wouldn't buy that he'd still get new tank bolts and seals. It's really trivial. I don't want to offend you or any professional plumbers who do the same as you, but I just have to say the very thought of me lugging around a toilet with tank attached is one I have a lot of trouble visualizing. Just can't come into focus.
Maybe that's why you can't find a video anywhere of somebody carrying a toilet with tank, excepting the cartoon you posted.
I did find this:
And this contraption is made - I guess - to avoid removing the tank
This discussion kind of reminds me of the Catalytic Converter "lockup" thread. I find the idea of locking up my catalytic converter or moving a toilet with tank attached ludicrous. But others feel differently about both. In the end we do what works for us.
--Vic
re: "but one strong person can do it by standing over the bowl with one foot on each side (sort of in a squat facing the tank), and lifting where the bowl connects to the tank."
That's exactly how I do it...and I'm curious as to what they mean by "strong".
I'm no body building super stud, trust me, but, to keep it relevant, I'm strong enough to put a toilet on a cart at HD, load it into my van, move it into the house, decide I don't like it, put it back into my van, back on a cart and back into HD, by myself.
I can then repeat the process at Lowes, again, by myself.
Granted - I really would have liked to have had help, but just wasn't available.
If that makes me "strong", I'll accept that.
BTW..I always find it interesting that when people are trying to make a point, they detail the worst that can happen:
"dripping whatever on the hallway carpeting"
"a clumsy assembly"
I don't drip anything onto the floor, and I find the straight up and down lifting of the unit pretty simple and efficient.
As you said..."In the end we do what works for us."
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