One of the reasons that the credit card issuers forbid the asking of
additional ID by the user is that most requests are for a driver's
license. Many DL's carry SS#'s, DOB, and address. These are prime
items for identity theft and fraud.
Since 1969 (my 1st CC) I have never been asked for ID and I have made
charges from about $10 to one for $22,000.
If you are asked for additional ID you are being asked to participate
in breaching a civil agreement between the merchant and the CC issuer.
You could be giving your CC issuer a means to challenge a fraud claim.
Correct with Visa and MasterCard. And I usually decline a
request for additional id.
However, if you use other credit card types (like American
Express) the merchant may be permitted to require additional
| Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". |
If a waiter did ask me for both CC and license I might ask my dining
companion to help me follow him at a distance to see where he went and what
he did with the card and the license so that I could have a witness to my
citizen's arrest if I saw the waiter photographing my license with a
cellphone cam. There is no GOOD reason to take the license away. You can
*perhaps* use it to compare the signature with the signed receipt *at the
table* but walking out of sight with it is, in my mind, a sure sign of
something very rotten.
Good job! I sincerely hope that I didn't cause you any discomfort by my
response. I see lots of things that we all do and take for granted that
just aren't right. I am such a safety freak (my wife's best friend is a
safety engineer who makes me look casual about safety) that not only will I
not use cards at restaurants, but I also jot down the first few digits of a
$100 bill's serial number on a napkin before handing the cash to a waiter.
My poor departed grandmother got scammed by a clerk taking her twenty dollar
bill, walking in in the back with it, and coming back and claiming it was a
counterfeit. It wasn't and they were unloading one they took in on her
because she was old, frail and spoke English with an accent. I tell that
story to my dining companions and write the serial number fragment down so
that if the waiter comes back with a counterfeit bill, I can make a very
strong case right then and there that a switch was made. So far, so good.
I've only been scammed once at a Thai restaurant that gave me foreign coins
in change so now I even look at that closely.
My knowledge about the Mastercard/VISA rules is rusty at best, but I knew
that walking away with your card and license is just not allowed, especially
now that both card companies are being plagued with skimmers and other forms
of ID theft.
I know that in Europe, they bring an imprinter or an electronic reader to
your table so that your card never leaves your view - at least in almost all
the places I dined at. Many of the credit cards there also have an RF chip
that makes skimming quite a bit harder. I assume from that experience
that's also your right in America, but honestly, that's something I am not
sure about and it seems that you'll be finding out about.
One good reason, beyond the ID theft threat, not to hand over your ID is
that it often gets mixed up and people get the wrong cards back, sometimes
too late to do anything about it immediately because the other patrons have
already left with YOUR card.
I've known too many waiters to trust them with a burned out match, let alone
something of value to me.
I believe that if you ask, they MUST bring an imprinter to the table but I
haven't had a chance to call VISA and confirm it. After all, they tell you
that you shouldn't let anyone else use your card. To then force you to put
it in the hands of a stranger seems a bit contrary to that advice. It's a
matter of convenience for restaurant merchants and the epidemic of
restaurant card skimming sweeping the nation could easily put an end to the
"convenience" of having a waiter you've never seen before disappear with
your card for five or ten minutes.
Only off unencrypted chips. Again it's the CC companies not wanting to
scare merchants off by requiring them to invest in expensive and safer
equipment that's driving the train in the US, AFAIK. The data capacity of a
chipped CC is far greater than the mag stripe technology and much harder to
skim. But I will agree that there's always someone building a taller
Back in the early 80's NSA instituted a card system that allowed people to
access various secured areas based on the RFID chips. Sov spies sat outside
in the parking lot with hi-tech skimmers that could read the codes well
enough to determine who the big-wigs were. It was quickly abandoned.
So were the furnaces that burned the copious classified papers that
accumulated daily when a furnace exploded and blew almost a ton of unburned
classified data into the air at Ft. Meade. The fort's soldiers were kept
very busy for the next few days scouring the nearby woods for TS docs. They
switched to a shredding/slurry process that makes the classified waste into
a sort of paper mache that's then dried AND burned. It's hard to
reconstitute shredded goo. Details are in the book "The Puzzle Palace."
If *you've* had it happen once, you can pretty much bet it's happened to
other people. I got scammed once at the now defunct Hechingers. I was
tired, it was near closing and the clerk made a mistake (I think
deliberately) on the receipt. In the ensuing hubbub I forgot to get the
card back and it was used within an hour after leaving the store by the
thief. Fortunately I realized that it was missing when I went to charge
some gasoline for the trip home.
After that I thought about buying an electronic wallet that beeps if you put
it away without the missing credit card, but after than experience, I pretty
much stopped using them except for places where it's almost impossible not
to, like booking hotels and air flights. Now that the TSA has made flying a
torture, I only use them to book hotels. I may yet have to buy that wallet
as I become more and more forgetful. )-:
That's because you did not use your own signature. You used someone
else's signature. I know this for fact because I saw you sign it
using the signature of your neighbor's wife. That's called FRAUD.
The police will pick you up in an hour or so. Pack your jail bags.
Kurt said he only used bank ATMs because others were easy to tamper with. I
replied that I never used bank ATMs because they were too expensive. The
implication was that I used ATMs but not those owned/operated by banks.
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