GFCI vs appliance manufacturers -previously elec code Q

Washer and dryer, use a GFCI. (I assume it's a gas dryer)

Refrigerator or freezer, no GFCI (but you may need to use a single receptacle instead of a duplex so you can claim it's a dedicated special-use receptacle.)

Bob

The dedicated receptacle exception to the requirement for GFCIs in unfinished basements has been eliminated in the current version of the NEC (2008). Current leakage standards for appliances have also been tightened, and new refrigerators or freezers should not trip a GFCI. If a new appliance trips a normal GFCI, the appliance is defective.

As for using older appliances, that presents a problem. :-) I guess if your old appliance has a leakage current of more than 5ma, then you can't use it in an unfinished basement in an NEC-compliant fashion.

Cheers, Wayne

There is no exception to the GFCI requirement for outlets in "unfinished" parts of a basement. If the manufacturer recommends the appliance not be GFCI protected, I wouldn't put them in the basement. I have never seen such documentation though. Have you actually seen this written somewhere other than bloggers opinions ?

Hi, For me, no. Both have inductive load(motor, heating elemnt), GFCI may trip from now and then which will be nuisance.

Suppose one was to carpet the area where the washer and dryer sit. Maybe at least 3' or 4' around the washer and dryer. Compliant?

Here was one

Probably not, because they'd still be next to the deep sink.

nate

"Finished" is not defined in the NEC, so it is pretty subjective and up to you and your inspector to figure out.

Wayne

The current at both ends of and inductor is the same. The major problem that I have heard of is "leakage". The UL test is now 0.5mA or lower leakage.

The NEC used to have exceptions to GFCI requirements for refrigerators. As Wayne and RBM said, the exceptions are now gone. The code making panels don't think there is a problem. Maybe Joe should ask manufacturers why their appliances wouldn't work.

Plug-in 15/20A refrigeration in commercial kitchens is required to be GFCI protected.

Some states like Oregon have amendments to the NEC where you can use a regular outlet for things like a refrigerator or freezer in a garage or basement. I don't know if this includes a washer?

But anyway check with your local electrical inspector. Local areas can make changes / amendments to the national code...

"Surges," etc. don't cause a GFCI to trip.

Yeah, it's that simple.

Some appliances are expected to have higher than usual "leakage" to ground.

Among those are: toasters, washing machines, & dish washers. Yet each and all of these shouldn't trip a GFCI when there aren't any leaks.

Older fridges sometimes permitted water to contact the defrost heaters during defrost.

BUT properly working appliance with a "ground pin" in the cord or that are deliberately grounded shouldn't cause a GFCI to trip.

If you have an old freezer or ice box you keep in the garage or some other place where you don't check it every day, you SHOULD put it one a GFCI but you also should install some kind of alarm when the appliance fails to maintain temperature.

RE: The quotes from manufacturers linked above at applianceaid.com, the one for Amana appears legit, as I searched the text and found it on the Amana official website at

-5. As for the GE quote, I can't find it except in forums echo-chambers. Cl osest I've gotten is a forum poster who suggests they heard it first-hand f rom GE, but the trail runs cold there, so far.

I'm trying to find GE claiming GFCI's are bad for their appliances. It's ju st about impossible to install a dryer in a location that doesn't require G FCI protection. 6' from a sink edge. Bam! Basement or garage: Bam! Even if none of those applies, all the conditions that apply for GFCI and make them a good idea in a kitchen or bathroom or basement, apply at least as much i n a laundry.

Hi For me any thing with electrical motor is bad to connect to GFCI. Motor start surge will trip it which is not nice. Ouir laundry pair is located in the basement utility room next to wash tub. No GFCI.

There is no reason why a motor should trip a GFCI if it is not bad.

Hi, Any inductivre load will cause surge current.

So? The GFCI only compares the current going out with the current coming back. If they are equal, the GFCI does not trip. When you have an internal short in the motor (usually a motor compressor like a fridge) the GFCI trips ... like it is supposed to.

I guarantee, if you have a fridge that is tripping a GFCI, and you put a current probe on the ground wire from that fridge, it will show leakage current there. You might not see it on a clamp on ammeter since it only needs to be

That is also one of the reasons why an old fridge starts using more power and why the freon will smell burned if you crack it open.

We know there must not be much of a problem with motorized hand tools since every legal job site has GFCI on all of the circuits All commercial refrigeration that is cord and plug connected is on GFCI now too.

Hi, Simply are you saying inductive load when power is applied is not causing momentary spikes? That is the cause of trip. Yes, I have a dual trace Tek storage scope good for catching pulses down to nano seconds. Most of time it gets by but I don't want even occasional trips. My kitchen sub panel is fed by GFCI breaker and the trip does happen from now and then. Depending time of the day and what's running in the kitchen at the moment.

I am saying that current spike is seen on both sides of the circuit and should not trip a GFCI.

Do you have a current probe for that scope? Put it on the EGC (ground wire) hook the offending equipment to a non-GFCI circuit and I bet you see the current that is tripping your GFCI.

A good meter with a "save" function would do it too.

If you are brave and very sure of yourself float that ground with an old 2 prong adapter, hold the pigtail and crank up that "good" equipment while you are well grounded

"farewell and adieu to you spanish ladies"..