Chemical fertilizers?

[korey99]

Hi all-

I hope I'm not going to start a big mess, but I had a question. I've read lots about the opinion of many in this group that the pesticides used by lawn services and in Weed and Feed products are bad news. I don't need to be sold on that one; I have a very young son who will be playing on that grass next year, and whether 2,4D's danger is confirmed or not, I don't plan to take any chances. Regarding danger, is the same true for the actual granular fertilizer (without weed/insect treatments)?

I've read up on organic gardening as well, and what I've read indicates that I should build healthy dense turf to choke out weeds (a no-brainer). They recommend applying 1/4 to 1/2" of compost to the lawn twice a year as fertilizer. I've got 12,000 sq ft of lawn though, and by my figuring that's about 20 to 40 cubic yards of compost each year. I don't want to say that's infeasible, but that's still several trips by delivery truck (or several more in my pickup) each time, not to mention the expense. Is the general consensus that chemical fertilizers themselves are bad, or is it the herbicides and insecticides that often accompany them?

Thanks, Korey

[bamboo]

Whoever is mowing should mow at a high setting and let the clippings lay. This means they have to use a sharp blade and cut fairly often. You don't apply fertilizer without first doing a soil test and correcting the pH and then you apply fertilizer at the rate the soil test reccomends. I don't care what type of fertillizer you use it is still going to go down in pounds of nutrient per 1000 sq ft Never mind what the goose step four step guys on the commercials are saying.

[Richard Cline]

Your math is off by about a factor of 2. Still 9 to 18 yards are a lot of compost is a lot. I would guess that you don't need nearly that much. The chemical fertilizers have not been accused of creating health problems except for those who insist on organic foods.

Dick

[David Bockman]

"korey99" wrote in news: [e-mail]:

Not really, no.

That's a lot of compost! Certainly, yearly topdressing is a wonderful thing, but unless you have access to high quality, reasonably priced compost, that could become pretty expensive. I inherited an atrocious lawn when I purchased a ca. 1952 home-- the lawn had probably *never* been dethatched/core aerated and the turf looked like it. That first year I dethatched/core aerated, used a pre-emergent to at least get a handle on the weeds, and then used a yearly regimen of overseeding, fertilizing, core aerating, and spot weeding until now, 5 years later, I have a pretty fine looking lawn. For a yearly feeding schedule, I use Espoma's excellent manual available at

that you don't have to use Espoma products for the schedule, you can use comparable organic brands.

With regard to your last question, the general concensus is that the source of fertilizer is somewhat irelevant-- grass doesn't know if nitrogen is coming from manure or from 'the blue stuff' you find in Miracle Grow-- however, synthetic nitrogen sources are usually exceedingly 'hot' (as in the case of Scott's Weed and Feed), so you get a big unhealthy kick of nutrients that green up your lawn quickly. A more modest approach is better for longterm health of the turf.

[korey99]

Well, I was talking about applying twice a year, and I was quoting the yearly figure, so I _think_ its right. Either way, that's (literally) tons of compost...

I've been thinking about just applying some compost to my front yard, to please my neighbors, since that soil up there is dismal quality. As the first respondent said, I'll need to get my soil tested as well.

[Phisherman]

Read the label. I would not allow a child to play in the grass after any fertilizer application, until after a rain.

Chemical fertilizers are not bad if used properly. Organic fertilizers could contain harmful bacteria and/or heavy metals. I use both inorganic (3x a year) and organic (one time per year) applications to my lawn. If you use a mulching mower, you automatically and safely return nitrogen to the lawn. With herbicides and insecticides, follow the label directions and use common sense.

[Vox Humana]

Organic fertilizers can cause burns if you get the granules in your eye or they contact any mucous membranes. Therefore you shouldn't let the kids on the lawn until the fertilizer has been watered in.

The issue many people have with organic fertilizers is that they are often applied incorrectly because people don't bother to read the label. The excessive nutrients then wash off and enter streams where they can cause problems. They are probably more of an environmental hazard than a personal hazard.

[David Ross]

Compost actually has little nutrient value. Its primary value is in improving the structure of the soil. Good compost (home-grown) also contains soil bacteria that help break down fertilizers (organic or synthetic) into the forms that can be used by plant roots. If your lawn does not seem to respond to fertilize, top with compost. This should be necessary only once.

I buy whatever off-brand lawn food that is the cheapest in terms of dollars per pound of nitrogen. Nitrogen is the key nutrient because it breaks down and is leached away the quickest. However, I would not recommend a nitrogen-only fertilizer (e.g., ammonium sulfate) for a lawn unless a soil test shows there is already sufficient phosphorus and potassium.

With a chemical fertilizer, take the time to feed only half as much as recommended but twice as often (unless it is already formulated as slow-release). This ensures a more constant availability of nutrients, avoids burning the lawn, and does not overwhelm the soil bacteria.

When feeding, you can mix the fertilizer with soil sulfur (for alkaline soil) or lime (for acidic soil). If your soil is clay, you can also mix with gypsum. I would do this only in repsonse to a soil test. Note: If you are an organic gardener, there are natural sources of sulfur, lime, and gypsum that should be acceptable.

[Ann]

David Bockman expounded:

I second the Espoma product, it's reasonably priced, for the two applications I do a year, spring and mid-fall. My lawn is lush and green, and doesn't grow like crazy (like grass does when it's hit with ChemLawn or Scotts).

[Vox Humana]

I should have said "inorganic," not "organic"

[Derryl]

Hi Korey

General fertilizers are good for your lawn and environment if they are spread properly and watered in. I don't like to use weed and feed products.

You can use a regular fertilizer on your lawn. I reccomend CIL Golf Green. This is a slow release product which will feed over an extended period of time.

In the auttumn use CIL winterizer to harden the grass for winter and increase disease resistance.

Water it in well. Your son can play on the lawn after the watering with out any ill effects.

It would take one hour with a fertilizer spreader to fertilize all of your lawn and 6 hours of watering to water it in.

There are no nutrients in compost and it needs free Nitrogen to decompose. Plus it would be very expensive to buy four dump truck loads every year. The labour of spreading and working in the compost would entail 3 days work.

Do not use Weed and feed if you have no weeds. I reccomend that you use 2' 4-D according to the instructions if you have weeds in the lawn.

A lawn service company will do an excellent job of weed control and fertilizing. The grass is safe to play on after it dries.

Derryl Killan [e-mail]

Horticulturalist