We have a problem with a couple of radiators not getting hot (2 in
lounge and one in dining room) British gas have diagnosed sludge in the
system and recommend a power flush at £565.
Being a yorkshire man and skint I wondered about trying sentinels X400
sludge remove has anyone any experience of it? Also I just thought I
would run out a bit of water from the system tip the stuff in the header
tank and let it run for a week or so then flush and off we go but their
website talks about needing to use a dosing vessel is this the case?
I would start by taking all the radiators off and flushing them with a
hosepipe. Then refit the radiators add the X400 and let it run for a week or
so before redoing the flushing.
If you are able to connect a hosepipe to the pipework you can also flush out
the pipework before refiting the rads.
Don't forget to add X100 when you have finished.
Stay well clear of British Gas, call a smaller local company. BG were
a colleague as they had a heating insurance with them. The first question
BG was "does the boiler switch on and function?". When she said it didn't,
wanted a callout fee which was stupidly paid. The recommendation without
even taking the boiler cover off was an entire new central heating system.
BG are either conning people like they do with their much higher energy
or they operate a bonus scheme for employees. The more they sell, or more
orders generated, the more they are paid.
The diagnosis from a local company was to do with the fan inside which was
replaced for a fraction of the £5k+ BG wanted to renew everything including
the pipes. The heating works perfectly now.
What boiler companies should be concerned about is the way cowboys like
British Gas devalue their brand names by clearly stating that the boiler
go faulty and how much the manufacturer charges for components. There
be a way of using EU Law that applies to other consumer goods. You have 5
years to sue a company if a product does not last a reasonable time. If
are currently being made to malfunction within 2 years we should get a list
together. Maybe BG go for people with one make more than others!
If anything is sold with a requirement to have a warranty then walk away.
You would be better buying stuff from a local plumbing shop, they will
you how to use it. Flushing a system isn't hard. Just make sure you put
additive in afterwards as you refill. Fernox or similar is OK.
Was she actually on a BG maintenance contract at the time and if she was
what Contract Option is she paying for? If she has the old 3 star
maintenance contract (option 3 now I believe) with them then there would be
no request for a call out fee as the whole system is covered for breakdown -
but there is on the lower options of cover. Could you tell us what level of
cover she is/was on at the time?
That is not, and never has been my experience with BG and their maintenance
contracts. They have *ALWAYS* been entirely honest in their dealings - and
in fact, kept an old boiler of mine working until it was impossible to
obtain the parts - and then replaced the boiler *WITHOUT* "attempting" to
change the whole system.
Not quite true, if the boiler has recurring problems, BG operatives will
*advise* that it needs replacement - and then it's up to the customer where
they go for it. *AND* that has been my experience of BG over many years.
That has never been my experience - the operatives that I have dealt with
have *ALWAYS* been truthful (and accurate) in their information.
I Have *NEVER* had BG say such a statement to me - would please tell us of
your source for that statement.
You are spouting misinformation yet again, or you are totally confused as to
how the Sale of Good Act 1979 (as amended) actually applies.
To reiterate from another post to you, SoGA only applies to goods that are
"inherently faulty" due to manufacturing or material defects *AND**NOT*
wear and tear. For *accurate* information see:
What an utter load of cobblers - and since when as BG made boilers? They
actually get them from reputable manufacturers - believe it or not.
Again not quite as easy as you make it sound in practise - especially for
those who have little or no knowledge of what they are doing in this case.
As a matter of interest, BG did a power flush for me in 2002, the spent
nearly 8 hours doing the job (which included several unforeseen repairs to
my system [around £200 at private contractors rates] as part of the cost of
the flush - and the job is guaranteed for life, (which means they will
re-flush it FOC if it needs doing again) - and the job is as good now as
when it was done.
I got an extortionate quote from BG once for a complete CH system. I asked
which boiler they proposed. He said it was specially made for BG by
Worcester Bosch. I pushed him for the model, which he only divulged when I
said I was not going to buy an unknown boiler for that sort of money. He
gave me the model number. Turns out it was a boiler, no longer advertised
My previous experience of BG was in North Wales where they installed a
complete CH system (I was in a hurry). It took them four months (!) to get
it working, which involved engineers (?) visiting at least twice a week.
Finally a man from the boiler company came round, there were five people in
my house scratching their heads and/or arses. No solution.
Next day the original installer came round with a wiring diagram. He
scratched his head for half an hour. I asked him what the drawing was. He
said that the boiler company had told him there was a wiring error, but he
was confused because there weren't enough wires in the muticore cable from
the boiler to the hot water cylinder electrics. I had a look and confirmed
this, and told him he'd have to run a cable with an extra way. He did the
job and it cured the problem. He said he couldn't understand it because he
always used the cable he originally used for my set up. I asked him how many
he had installed, he said about 10. So I asked if anyone else had problems.
He said about 5 of them had had trouble!
Apparently he was a gas fitter who had been sent on a 2 day wiring course,
say no more.
He also originally installed the room thermostat on the wall behind which
the hot water cylinder was. As a consequence the room stat was only an on
off switch as the hot water cylinder was also heating up the thermostat. So
we were either very hot or cold.
I would like to thank BG for my crash course in central heating.
Ok chaps here is an update.
when the heating first starts all the rads get hot and everthing is as
it always has been after 30 mins or so some of the rads cool down and
never seem to get back to heat namely the two in the lounge, one in the
dinning room and the down stairs loo. The kitchen, hall and study all
keep hot as do all bar one upstairs (the main bedroom) if you look at
the house the boiler is on the left and the rads which lose heat are all
on the right.
Does this really sound like a sludge issue sureley the rads should never
get hot if the are blocked, or am I missing something simple ? Have a
few days off next week so might well take a rad out and see whats in it.
The theromstat is making
If they all heat up to start with, that virtually eliminates
sludge.Sounds like a possible air lock that trundles around the system
for a while and gets stuck in a few places.
Have you tried switching the system off (making sure the pump is not
still running) and then going through the process of bleeding all of
your rads, starting downstairs and working your way up?
I am a plumber, but I've never heard of a system acting quite like yours.
If the rads are old, there may be some sludge anyway. Like you say, it
might be worth a check.
A good system flush out won't do it any harm, as long as you put some
inhibitor in afterwards. I'd recommend "Fernox", it's the dearest but is
the best IMO.
Can you confirm (a) whether you have TRV's fitted on all / any of the rads?
and (b) if the rads which get hot initially (as well as the rads which stay
hot) are hot at the top of the rad as well as lower down?
I agree it doesn't sound like a sludge issue at this stage.
If you haven't got TRVs fitted, have you tried running the system with
*both* valves (i.e. including lock-shield valve) on every rad fully open?
And what happens if you try running the system with the rads which "stay
hot" turned off completely?
(If you've got TRVs, have you also got the little plastic caps which can
temporarily replace the TRV caps, and force them fully open?)
I'm assuming answers to the above (and anything else you can try) may help
the folk here diagnose the likely problem.
Finally (and apols if you know this) take care if you try removing a rad.
The black gunge in the bottom of all rads will ruin carpets etc. - so you
need masses of water-proof protective sheeting and a spare pair of hands...!
And make sure the "plunger" underneath the cap is free - I had to
wiggle mine with pliers to pull it out, iy stayed stuck in even after
the TVR caps had been removed. (Also put a spot of WD40 on them
afterwards.... no bother since).
Ok Guys latest update.
I have bleed all the radiators I got air in two of the upstairs ones,
the one in sons bedroom we have to bleed about every two months any way.
It made no differene etwo the two rads which go cold in the lounge.
The rads that start hot and then go cold dont have TRV's fitted.
Tonight lounge rads came on went cold I have now turned off rads in the
hall and study and the two in the lounge are now hot enough to take the
skin of my hand. One thing I noticed was that they got hot from the top
down (is this normal) and even now there seems to be a temp difference
between the top and bottom of the rad ie top is hottest.
Any thoughts gents.
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